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Forum Messages Posted by vineyards

(1954 Messages in 196 pages - View all)
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Thread: informal thoughts on Turkish Class

1561.       vineyards
1954 posts
 27 Sep 2007 Thu 08:06 pm

Quoting catwoman:

Quoting vineyards:

Catwoman take your time and write a few more paragraphs to explain your opinion. All you are saying is yes it is true; no it's not right.
Here is my answer: no, you are wrong...


You are contradicting yourself now though because you said earlier that it's a matter of personal opinions, so how can you tell me that I'm wrong????
And I was thinking that we are here to have a reason-based dialogue not to decide who's wrong..




If we are not here to find out who is right or wrong don't say you are wrong twice in your previous message. When I said you are wrong I wanted to accentuate this point. We shouldn't say you are wrong or right we should take the time and explain our own points instead. Your contradictions are plenty.



Thread: informal thoughts on Turkish Class

1562.       vineyards
1954 posts
 27 Sep 2007 Thu 07:58 pm

Quote:

Quote:


Yes, I agree. If you're adding milder nationalists you should definitely add Ataturk before Bush.



Yes, after reading this I should be mad at you and flame you because I consider Ataturk as a national hero and you are adding it on the same list with Stalin, Hitler and Bush.

Sorry, I thought and decided I am not that cheap.

I made a number of very serious accusations to you. You did not want to answer them and now looking to have a chance to get even.



Thread: informal thoughts on Turkish Class

1563.       vineyards
1954 posts
 27 Sep 2007 Thu 07:49 pm

Catwoman take your time and write a few more paragraphs to explain your opinion. All you are saying is yes it is true; no it's not right.
Here is my answer: no, you are wrong...



Thread: informal thoughts on Turkish Class

1564.       vineyards
1954 posts
 27 Sep 2007 Thu 07:44 pm

Reason your reason.



Thread: informal thoughts on Turkish Class

1565.       vineyards
1954 posts
 27 Sep 2007 Thu 07:39 pm

thehandsom, you are contradicting with your own statement when you say most patriots in Turkey are nationalists. Well if someone is a nationalist then he is not exactly a patriot by definition. Maybe you would like to say something like this: of those who can be broadly (and unnecessarily) categorized as patriots, nationalists, right-wing chauvenists etc. the majority is held by nationalists. Even so, patriots are patriots and nationalists are nationalists. You shouldn't refer to one of them and describe the other.

As I wrote earlier, definitions of those concepts vary dramatically depending on the culture or subculture you belong to. Just because you consider yourself thehandsome not every girl is supposed to be crazy for you.



Thread: Uskudar

1566.       vineyards
1954 posts
 27 Sep 2007 Thu 03:31 am

Did you check out Trudy's list and my lengthy comment that developed around a boarding house in Fenerbahce?



Thread: informal thoughts on cigarette

1567.       vineyards
1954 posts
 27 Sep 2007 Thu 03:02 am

I quit seven years ago after smoking nearly 15 years. That was the best decision I have made.



Thread: Uskudar

1568.       vineyards
1954 posts
 27 Sep 2007 Thu 02:35 am

Remember the slogans of the two clubs?

Galatasaray: Die for you!
Fenerbahce : Kill for you!



Thread: I hate a belly dance

1569.       vineyards
1954 posts
 27 Sep 2007 Thu 12:37 am

Coitus interruptus! (Wake up from your fantasies)

There is a family of simple rhythms called Turk aksagi. Those of us who were raised in this culture and all the others who have developed a taste for it respond to this "Turk aksagi" almost instinctively by moving their bodies to its magical rhythm. Females I spoke with would say it is something that they just can't control. Once the rhythm begins they rush to populate the stage and whether it be with men with other females or all alone, they start swaying their hips in belly dance fashion. As seen belly dance is largely a cultural thing for those people.

Truth be told there are all kinds of people in any society. Some of those people are perverts, some of them are extra horny and it is not uncommon to find people with other such problems yet I still believe a great majority of people in any society are more less straight when it comes to sexuality. After all, common people want order, peace and prosperity and any corrupt personalities are just the flaws in the functioning of society. That being said some of us constantly complain of pervert males who always try to captivate women, strip them off their freedoms etc. This is obviously an obsessive way of thinking.

Going back to our main subject; just like many other misconceptions, the notion that bellydance causes women to become submissive along with the cliché depicting muslim males in their harems enjoying the erotic dances of their wives is nothing more than a Western fantasy which is way too shallow to hold any seed of truth in it. We should actually be looking to find the traces of a Western voyeurism in this perspective. After all, complete operas telling the story of a young and handsome European penetrating into the harem and kidnapping the sultan's favourite courtisan were written by those same Europeans.
You might think that would be a far fetched idea but think for a second how different the Western and Turkish connotations of the phrase "Turkish Bath" are. In Turkey hamam is very much like a spa. In other countries it also means "a brothel". I have never heard of sex parties being organized in Turkish hamams here but the Western mind is adept in fantacizing hot "Turkish Delights" doing their "Belly Dance" service in a different manner.

We know those fairy tales and Arabian nights. Not long ago an Arab was nothing more than a Turk even Greeks were regarded as Turks and vice versa. They still think Muslim describes all Middle Eastern people. Browse songs from the 50's with themes touching Turks, Arabs and muslims and you will see it for yourselves. You will be surprized at how shallow their perspective was then.

A German friend of mine takes belly dance costumes for his wife whenever he comes to Turkey. He says, his wife orders those costumes because she believes belly dance is both very enjoyable and a healthy exercise too. Obviously he likes watching his wife exclusively and who doesn't?

Women don't become submissive when they do this dance. There is an Arabic phrase describing the female sex as "cins-i latif" meaning the beautiful sex. If you have the right hormones, you would feel horny just by seeing a woman walk in the street. It is in our nature to get attracted to the other sex. If you are unable to let the whole thing flow in its nature course maybe time has come for you to dismiss the monk in your minds.



Thread: Uskudar

1570.       vineyards
1954 posts
 26 Sep 2007 Wed 10:11 pm

The first time I began to hate Fenerbahce fans was back in the 80's. I used live on Bahariye street then (there was vehicle traffic on it then) The hooligans would block the traffic, rock the public buses lining up on either sides of them and forcibly kiss the girls passing by. I detested this attitude of theirs and decided that I would have no business with them whatsoever.

There are also reasons to why I became a Galatasaray fan. One of the reasons was Jupp Derwall and the rest is a long story.



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