General/Off-topic |
Thread locked by a moderator or admin. |
|
|
|
|
GAZZE - WHAT IS GOING ON ?
|
| 40. |
29 Jan 2008 Tue 07:23 pm |
|
Arjun-Vishad The Dejection of Arjuna
Krishna! as I behold, come here to shed Their common blood, yon concourse of our kin, My members fail, my tongue dries in my mouth, A shudder thrills my body, and my hair Bristles with horror; from my weak hand slips Gandiv, the goodly bow; a fever burns My skin to parching; hardly may I stand; The life within me seems to swim and faint; Nothing do I foresee save woe and wail! It is not good, O Keshav! nought of good Can spring from mutual slaughter! Lo, I hate Triumph and domination, wealth and ease, Thus sadly won! Aho! what victory Can bring delight, Govinda! what rich spoils Could profit; what rule recompense; what span Of life itself seem sweet, bought with such blood? Seeing that these stand here, ready to die, For whose sake life was fair, and pleasure pleased, And power grew precious: - grandsires, sires, and sons. Brothers, and fathers-in-law, and sons-in-law, Elders and friends! Shall I deal death on these Even though they seek to slay us? Not one blow, O Madhusudan! will I strike to gain The rule of all Three Worlds; then, how much less To seize an earthly kingdom! Killing these Must breed but anguish, Krishna! If they be Guilty, we shall grow guilty by their deaths; Their sins will light on us, if we shall slay Those sons of Dhritirashtra, and our kin; What peace could come of that, O Madhava? For if indeed, blinded by lust and wrath, These cannot see, or will not see, the sin Of kingly lines o'erthrown and kinsmen slain, How should not we, who see, shun such a crime We who perceive the guilt and feel the shame Oh, thou Delight of Men, Janardana? By overthrow of houses perisheth Their sweet continuous household piety, And - rites neglected, piety extinct Enters impiety upon that home; Its women grow unwomaned, whence there spring Mad passions, and the mingling-up of castes, Sending a Hell-ward road that family, And whoso wrought its doom by wicked wrath. Nay, and the souls of honored ancestors Fall from their place of peace, being bereft Of funeral-cakes and the wan death-water.1
So teach our holy hymns. Thus, if we slay Kinsfolk and friends for love of earthly power, Ahovat! what an evil fault it were! Better I deem it, if my kinsmen strike, To face them weaponless, and bare my breast To shaft and spear, than answer blow with blow.
|
|
| 41. |
29 Jan 2008 Tue 07:40 pm |
|
does that somehow relate to Gaza and the palestinians?
|
|
| 42. |
29 Jan 2008 Tue 08:26 pm |
|
The situation in Palestine/Gaza/Israel is like a gangrenous wound. Quietly, insidiously it infects the whole world, rotting and destroying as it continues to fester and spread it's malodorous atmosphere unchecked.
|
|
| 43. |
30 Jan 2008 Wed 12:31 am |
|
Quoting teaschip1: Egypt occupied Gaza from 1948 to 1967. However when Israel and Egypt signed their peace treaty in 1979, in which Egypt got back much of their land lost in the 1967 war, they didn’t push the issue to get Gaza back. Why not? Because Gaza was occupied by Palestinians, which Egypt didn’t want responsibility for.
The Arab countries have not wanted to take responsibility for the Palestinians. Why are most Palestinians still living in refuge camps, not only in “occupied†territory, but Arab countries as well? Are the Palestinians being used as pawns in the battle to exercise “right of return†which would eliminate Israel as we now know it?
Why did the Palestinians only resort to terror tactics once Israel “occupied†the territories? Why didn’t they use these tactics they are using today against Jordan in the West Bank and Egypt in Gaza? Why didn’t they attack the civilian populations of the same countries as the do in Israel?
What historical president is there for a country to return land won in a war? Remember how many wars there were between Israel and multiple Arab countries. The 1967 war was started by Israel, but only because they had information that an attack was pending by Jordan, Egypt and Syria. If Israeli land was now occupied by any of those countries would there be similar demands for them to return captured territory?
Are the Palestinians pawns? Sadly, yes. Should they act as a state if they want to be treated as such? Yes. Are they (Hammas) doing so? No. Is there some blame for Israel for the current situation? Yes. Are they the only ones with such responsibility? No.
|
Actually,im afraid to say you got your base wrong,thats why you got your conclusions as wrong too!
First of all Egypt didnt OCCUPY Gaza from 1948 to 1967,because both Egypt and Gazza were occupied with GREAT BRİTİAN !
We just kicked them out from our lands in 1956,and then we got attacked by the 2 GREAT countries Britian and France and of course İsrael didnt miss that chance !
And on 1956 it was the time when UN devided Palastin into 2 parts,İsraelian and Arab.
So it was ,we take the responsibiliy of Gaza and keep the Palastinian live there,or İsrael have it and kick them out as she did to the others...
Thats why Palastinian live in other countries,because they have been kicked out of their country !
So Gazah was and still a Palastinian land ...and the responsibility of it goes to the Palastinian people not to anyone else !
Thats why when we signed our peace treaty in 1979 we didnt include Gazah too because we are not the one who should talk about it,but we suggested one to the Palastinians,and they refused it ...
İt was their decision..wrong or right,they carry its responsibility
''The Arab countries have not wanted to take responsibility for the Palestinians ''
İ guess you NEED to read more history before you made such comments,our blood are there in the Palastinian land in 1948 was flowing like river there..
That blood which we paid for it through the years,and in all our wars no one can deny,NOT even the palastinians
So i guess before you made such comment,and take people's rights,you need to read some history,they were our fathers and grandfathers,uncles who died there with honor
And their blood was not that cheep so you can easily come and say, ''Egypt didnt want to have responsibility for Palastinians ''
We didnt pay little,it was with high price and we've paid it...
You didnt even think once how Palastinians got that name ?
İ mean ,you are American,and your country is USA 'America' im Egyptian,and my country is Egypt
They are Palastinian...where is Palastin ?
Did you think it was a ghost or something ?a fairy tail ?
No dear...NO..it was there and exist before they took it from the Palastinians,and it İS there and STİLL exist.
So NO,and BİG NO...no one is going to take the responsibility of the Palastinians,NO one is going to take the responsibility of Gazah,because it has its own people,and Palastinians have their own country
They want live there,and fight for their land...
And no one,NO ONE can deny them that right !
To say,out of humanity we 'other countries not just us' must have them in our lands and give them home and shelters,that is like putting the poison in the honey.
İts not kindness or tenderness,its another invaid for their right to have their land!
They are and were welcome to live here ' in Egypt'they go to our schools,live among us ,with us..they are most welcome.
But they HAVE their land...and they want it.
İts not what WE want,its what THEY want
You cant just kick someone out of his home,then ask his neighbours out of humanity,to have them..and at same time forbid him to have or be in his home !
We welcome them,we host them,but they still want their home...can you blame them ?!
''Are the Palestinians being used as pawns in the battle to exercise “right of return†which would eliminate Israel as we now know it?''
Actually,i dont understand even the question !
Used by who ? and the right of return to whom ?!!!!
They..THE PALASTİNİANS are fighting to HAVE THEİR right of return to THEİR LANDS !
İts not a game,or something funny they ask for,they are people have been kicked out of THEİR country,and they fight to go back
''
Why did the Palestinians only resort to terror tactics once Israel “occupied†the territories? Why didn’t they use these tactics they are using today against Jordan in the West Bank and Egypt in Gaza? Why didn’t they attack the civilian populations of the same countries as the do in Israel? ''
Because we ALL were under the authority of GREAT BRİTİAN
WE didnt take anyone's land...unlike İsrael...i guess that is why they fighting İsrael and didnt fight us ?!
We ALL were invaded by Britian,and we didnt have our choices in our hands.
GOD !
''What historical president is there for a country to return land won in a war? Remember how many wars there were between Israel and multiple Arab countries. The 1967 war was started by Israel, but only because they had information that an attack was pending by Jordan, Egypt and Syria. If Israeli land was now occupied by any of those countries would there be similar demands for them to return captured territory? ''
Then if Mixco,took over the USA,you will just leave it to them and find yourself another nice country ?
Sorry,we dont work this way,OUR country İS OUR country,we pay our blood for it...
And so are the Palastinians too
return captured territory for İsrael...!
Hmmm,let me get this straight,İsrael wasnt exist before 1948,do you think its was an empty land there,with no people living in,with no name and identity? İsrael took their land on 1948 with a promise from who has no right to give what is not his!
İt was a promise from Britian,and when Palastinian take their land back from İsrael,then,they should give it back to İsrael again ?!
By any law ?!
And you know something ?
Palastinians dont demand even to have their whole land back,they just ask for what UN desided,for half of their lands,and even that,they cant have!
And the little what they already have,they fight for it,and you say WE should carry their responsibilities and have them in our countries,and they should leave their country!
WHAT YOU ACCEPT FOR YOURSEL,ACCEPT FOR OTHERS!
|
|
| 45. |
31 Jan 2008 Thu 06:59 pm |
|
Quoting farukdemirhan: i wish this topic have the largest amount of replies...
we r living kind of shame life , that we r even cant say that the people in Gazzah r suffering ...
here we r in need just for a word from u TC's friends..
We r not brave to do ...at least we should be brave to say that
WE R WITH U GAZZAH'S PEOPLE*
ANYONE? |
I AM WITH YOU GAZZAH'S PEOPLE*
WE ARE WITH YOU GAZZAH'S PEOPLE*
|
|
| 46. |
01 Feb 2008 Fri 12:07 pm |
|
Quoting SuiGeneris:
But indeed, this is very interesting and serious 'Topic' but i dont see anything close about this topic with Turkia.
|
İ agree,its a serious 'Topic' not related to Türkiye,but sure it was interesting to see and read how Turkish people react towards something SERİOUS happening to their neighbours...or let me say Eastern neighbours ?!
Not even a word of sympathy without criticizing !
Maybe they dont want to be mistaken of ''ARAB LOVERS''?!
Anyway,
Long live EU !
|
|
| 47. |
01 Feb 2008 Fri 04:03 pm |
|
Quote: First of all Egypt didnt OCCUPY Gaza from 1948 to 1967,because both Egypt and Gazza were occupied with GREAT BRİTİAN !
We just kicked them out from our lands in 1956,and then we got attacked by the 2 GREAT countries Britian and France and of course İsrael didnt miss that chance !
And on 1956 it was the time when UN devided Palastin into 2 parts,İsraelian and Arab.
So it was ,we take the responsibiliy of Gaza and keep the Palastinian live there,or İsrael have it and kick them out as she did to the others...
Thats why Palastinian live in other countries,because they have been kicked out of their country !
|
Following the dissolution of the British mandate of Palestine and 1947-1948 Civil War in Palestine, Israel declared its independence in May 1948. The Egyptian army invaded the area from the south, starting the 1948 Arab-Israeli War. [8] "Egypt occupied the Strip from 1949 (except for four months of Israeli occupation during the 1956 Suez Crisis) until 1967."
Source
Gaza Strip
From Wikipedia
Egypt didn't OCCUPY Gaza from 1948 70 1967? Canli...I think your history books are outdated......or maybe it's denial.
Let’s face it, Egypt does not want to look bad in the middle east but absolutely does not want to be active in the use of Gaza by Hamas and their financiers to make war against Israel. Anyone who does not see Hamas and those financing Hamas is THE Enemy of the people in Gaza can be sold absolutely anything.
Canli, why does Egypt maintain a wall between itself and Gaza, I was curious? While Israelis are scrutinized for maintaning a fence and stretches of a wall between themselves and Arab terrorists trying to infiltrate Israel from the "West Bank" to set off bombs and kill people. What's Egypt's reason?
|
|
| 48. |
01 Feb 2008 Fri 05:53 pm |
|
Quoting teaschip1: Quote: First of all Egypt didnt OCCUPY Gaza from 1948 to 1967,because both Egypt and Gazza were occupied with GREAT BRİTİAN !
We just kicked them out from our lands in 1956,and then we got attacked by the 2 GREAT countries Britian and France and of course İsrael didnt miss that chance !
And on 1956 it was the time when UN devided Palastin into 2 parts,İsraelian and Arab.
So it was ,we take the responsibiliy of Gaza and keep the Palastinian live there,or İsrael have it and kick them out as she did to the others...
Thats why Palastinian live in other countries,because they have been kicked out of their country !
|
Following the dissolution of the British mandate of Palestine and 1947-1948 Civil War in Palestine, Israel declared its independence in May 1948. The Egyptian army invaded the area from the south, starting the 1948 Arab-Israeli War. [8] "Egypt occupied the Strip from 1949 (except for four months of Israeli occupation during the 1956 Suez Crisis) until 1967."
Source
Gaza Strip
From Wikipedia
Egypt didn't OCCUPY Gaza from 1948 70 1967? Canli...I think your history books are outdated......or maybe it's denial.
Let’s face it, Egypt does not want to look bad in the middle east but absolutely does not want to be active in the use of Gaza by Hamas and their financiers to make war against Israel. Anyone who does not see Hamas and those financing Hamas is THE Enemy of the people in Gaza can be sold absolutely anything.
Canli, why does Egypt maintain a wall between itself and Gaza, I was curious? While Israelis are scrutinized for maintaning a fence and stretches of a wall between themselves and Arab terrorists trying to infiltrate Israel from the "West Bank" to set off bombs and kill people. What's Egypt's reason?
|
You didnt get it again as i see tea,did you ?
Egypt has been totally indebendent ON 1956 when last British solder left our lands
We've been ruled by Britian exactly till July 1952
So how can you say we Occupied Gazah from 1948
We both been occupied by Britian
We took our country back and Palstin did not obviously because it has been occupied by İsrael on 1948 after Britian
And on 1956 the UN seperated Palstin to 2 parts Arab and İsraeli,
On that time there was no Palstinian goverment to take over,so
AGAİN,it was either we take this responsibility,and let the land for its original people which is the Palastinians or İsrael take it,and by time kick them off as its trying now !
You really make me laugh,you quote from Wikipedia,and asking me to read MY history which was not far away,which grandfather,my father,uncles ,mother,aunts,lived it and told us about too not only studied it in school,which Palstinians still living it till now ?
And you want me to brows it ?!
Outdated? No dear,its updated,very much updated there at our borders !
''Canli, why does Egypt maintain a wall between itself and Gaza, I was curious?''
Why ?
You have open borders between you and Mixco or you and Canada ?
People can come and go all the times as they wants as if its one country ?!
WE are 2 different countries,Egypt,and Gazah which is part of Palastin,we should have borders.
İsrael,is İN THEİR lands,took part of of it,even accourding to the UN seperation borders,and making a fence so they cant renter it .
And you are comparing what ?!
|
|
| 49. |
01 Feb 2008 Fri 05:57 pm |
|
İ dont see what are you arguing about here actually
İsrael turing Palastinians life into hell in Gazah,people escape to our lands to get their life necessaries.
And you are BLAMİNG US for WHAT ?!
|
|
| 50. |
01 Feb 2008 Fri 06:33 pm |
|
Maybe Egypt should have not occupied Gaza from 1948 to 1967 after it attacked Israel in 1948? There would have been a Palestinian state 60 years old now had they hadn’t, and had Jordan not attacked Israel and occupied the west bank for the same time period. It all stems back to putting these people in refugee camps years ago, and by who.
And wouldn’t it be correct to draw the inference that up till now Egypt, like Israel, has also maintained a closed border with Gaza? Yet I seem only to have read accounts in the media of the cruel and brutal actions of the Israelis in blocking passage to and from Gaza, but not a single judgemental word till now about the Egyptians doing exactly the same (and why can’t they supply Gaza with energy, instead of the hated Zionist entity?
|
|
|
