DD, you first said Bush`s calling themsleves crusaders can`t be taken seriously because he is an idiot. I proved you that Bush is not more idiot than any other terrorist leader, and then you immediately change your argument saying that the crusade word is just a metaphor.

That`s just like America`s claiming that Saddam had mass destruction weapons and then when proved wrong saying they invaded Iraq to bring democracy.

You`ve lost all your credibility defending your christian brothers, DD.  I`m not gonna explain the same facts to you over and over again.

I´ll look for links tomorrow to remind you my lesson on metaphor and a lengthy lecture on understanding world´s politics. I´d do that today but it´s 1.00am and I´m sleepy.

And it never ceases to amuse me how you refer to my "Christian brothers" omitting the fact that I am not Christian I know using simplifications like that is easy and easily gets you high but it doesn´t make it true. In the first place,  I never knew I used to be credible to you in the past . Scary!!!

Still, you never answered my questions about what makes you believe that it´s a religious war - the only thing you have to support your theory of conspiracy with is that metaphor of Bush. But if that makes you feel better, go on, believe whatever you want (I´m not even going to convince you that Santa isn´t real - you´ll find a YouTube film with Bush talking about him and will understand it literally).

Oh and one more thing. i think I know where that Christianity obsession of yours is coming from. It must be hard to be in a country that was founded by people who were Christians. It must be painful to live there seeing how successful they are and how they´re making progress ensuring people have a better life. At the same time you see what happens in Muslim countries - most people still live in 7th century, people die when they convert, get clubbed when they drink or killed by family when raped. I understand that your brain cannot comprehend why it is the American (or, for the matter European) culture that can go beyond religion and focus on improving the quality of life, not the case in the Arab countries. So, you choose to forget that the principles that European (and thus American) culture do not come from Christianity. They come from Greek and Roman culture, philosophy, codes and laws. Christianity that started to mean something in Europe in 8-9th century was used as political force uniting nations. Kings would get christened because they wanted to be in a gang with other cool kings. Then the religion brought to Europe by sword and blood (yes, people were reluctant to forget their old gods) started to be a monopolist, which resulted in its institutionalisation, abuse and shock of power. Then we had inquisition. And then some people though it was too much and an anti-religious movement started. If you bothered to read about European countries and the US you will see that their legal systems are not based  on the Bible but on Greek and Roman legal systems.

So, as I said, you may want to simplify things if they´re too much to handle for your brain - you may consider Europe and the USA Christian missionaries but actually they are countries whose laws are not based on Christianity - how could they since even Christians cannot agree on the correct interpretations of Bible. Even most Christian holidays come from pagan times...And all those countries grant religious freedom.

Anyway, where was I? Oh yes. As you´re Turkish you know that you country´s position is specific. You are religiously more Arab than EU but it is the EU that can grant you better life. Yet, knocking on the door that remains closed must feel pretty humiliating so you´d rather pose as full of hate than full of shame. It´s like - I´ll hate them first - sort of game. Plus it´s quite safe,   it´s easier to say - they´re Christians and that´s why they hate Muslims - because in case something goes wrong with your plans you may blame it on a Christian conspiracy that didn´t give  Muslim boy a chance rather than admit being a loser.

what makes you think that muslims blew up the wtc? we all know that it was the very christian american government who did it. if it`s not a war on muslims, why did the christians invade Iraq and genocide one million of muslims instead of invading Thailand and genociding one million of buddhists? what were the genocided Iraqis guilty of other being muslims?

What would you call it if 6 muslim countries invaded a christian county and killed one million of christian. You would call it a christian genocide.  Is it a coincidence that only the christian countries in the 21st century keep invading other countries and is it a coincidence that the countries they invade are always muslim populated?

But we still shouldn`t think that it`s a religious war, right? so that the christians once again can get away with their crimes.

what does being "religously more Arab" mean? "Arab" is not a religion, but if you think it`s, you are also "Arab" to the same degree because your f**king jesus was an Arab.  Still I can`t see how being Arab grants you a worse life or makes you something inferior than the christian nazis .

You once again threw out your sick christian nazist ideas, thanks for proving me right.

DD comes in and restores the order..

Respect  

yeah you show respect only when nazis throw out racist propaganda, right? what should be done to the "Arab subhumans"? is genocide the only solution?

I dont think she is the one who is racist here..

She is DD ..  

DD, you can humiliate muslim countries as much as you can, nothing changes since they are happy with their lives and noone has right to force them change or invade their country, if those were independent countries, it is their business to choose how they want to live not US or EU. Besides i think you havent been to any of Arabic countries, be sure that people in those countries live better than any of you, thanks to petrol, and i assure you that all of those artificial countries supported by US because they are the best slaves and because US richness is also coming from there . I dont know what will happen when petrol finishes ...

Lastly let me remind you, in Turkey the ones who are craving for EU, is the islamists and liberals nowadays not the whole people. In fact if anyone ask them what EU is, they dont care or not much knowlegde about it. It seems the humiliating you described is what you feel when your country Poland was being ruled by socialism

I don´t think there´s anything more sad than people whose basic human rights are violated and who do not know what freedom is and who say they are happy to live in those conditions (and who mean it, never mind those who say it because they have no choice). It´s like birds in golden cages who are happy to be imprisoned and say, look the cage is golden, doesn´t that count for something?

Actually they learned what freedom is from Iraq and Afghanistan where US is still on duty. In fact it seems invading a country makes the situation worse. And of course i agree they should get rid of their puppet leaders that US assigned(that will possibly make them enemy with US btw). Iran was the most dearest ally of US and UK at time of Shah, Tehran was called the Paris of east, then what happened, the regime changed mollas kicked out of the blood suckers from their country, that followed a war between Iraq and Iran where Saddam was supported by US, now they became the first target of west, why? thats because of petrol that they couldnt smell of it anymore.(Note that i do not support those mollas and the way they treat their citizens but i appreciate their truly stand against the US.)

If Arab countries are such a great place to be, how come the migrations flow is to the evil west? The number of evil westerners moving to eastern paradise is not huge to my knowledge. Of course there are people who are well-off in Arab countries, why shouldn´t there be? I´m sure if you compare the number of western migrants in the east to the number of Arab migrants in the west, the numbers will show where people would rather live...

I didn´t intend to depreciate Arabic countries, it was an illegal sarcastic jab at Tami who is the biggest hypocrite on this site and a very angry young man- he hates west, its policies, doesn´t know the basics of our culture or history and thus jumps to conclusions and operates on simplifications and yet he chose to live in the states and benefit from the hatered country.

Tami, what do you mean "we" know it wasn´t Arabs behind WTC? I think you mean "you" know it because I don´t. I do believe that it actually was Arabs but I don´t think it was for religious reasons that they did it. I agree that the evil west is the biggest aggressor in contemporary world and is the greediest invader and self-proclaimed guardian of democracy that nobody needs. But what I can´t agree is that the reason of it is religion. Unless, of course, we consider money to be religion .