Stumpy, if some maniac takes the reins of your own country, will you go and ask for help from Turkey?

Every country must determine their own fate and must pay what is necessary.

When he rose to power they said he would be the next deccal but it seems he is proving how wrong that assumption was. Putin made a statement saying the UN´s call for attacking Libya is  no different from the crusade calls of the medieval times. He said Qaddafi´s regime does not live up to the democratic norms but that doesn´t justify an armed intervention.

In the aftermath of the 1980 coup millions of people in Turkey were jailed, subjected to tortures, and some were evaporated, no one ever threatened Turkey. Thank God we don´t have oil. Because I would prefer to be tortured by my own people rather than having to fight yet another war of independence.  

Daydreamer, the European campaigns of the Ottoman Empire came at a time when great conquests were the rule of the game if one wanted to exist as an empire. You either swallow others or get swallowed by others. For example, Russia declared war against Ottomans many times using the smallest excuse. The idea was to capture Istanbul and reach the warm seas. They couldn´t do this since the conjuncture did not permit. Turks campaigns in Europe could be considered as the reverse engineering of the famous and glorious crusades which are now remembered as heroic tales in the folklores of participating countries. What the Ottomans did was restructuring the East to overcome and reverse European brutality. Istanbul witnessed one of the greatest pillages and destruction at the hands of the crusaders who hated the Orthodox Byzantines of the time. The famous Hagia Sophia was robbed and pillaged as well. In fact, that was the biggest catostrophy that 1500 year old structure ever experienced.

Anatolia was like an otobahn for the crusaders who murdered the inhabitants, robbed their property and overthrew local lords. Turkish presence in Europe is largely a result of the hatred caused by the crusades. 

Janissaries are often exagerated, they are a very small part of the Ottoman army. Since their history is a bit turbulant and since they are essentially the kids captured from the Europeans, everybody thinks they were the main Ottoman power. During the campaigns in the Balkans, the army needed more fighters and they employed bashibozouks who are mainly legionnaires who were not paid any salary. Their main income was the bounties they would get from the pillages they get involved in. That being the mode of working, these people began tormenting locals and created problems for both their employers and the locals whose safety is jeopardized even after the end of the war. That is why they are called bashibozouks which literally means uncontrollable. They were often executed or severely punished at the end of a war. They are also usually local slav outlaws who did not want to miss the opportunity of making a fortune at wartime. There were also Janissary dayis who turned themselves into despots. They were like local sheriffs.   

There has been an ongoing discussion between me and a Serbian member (Slavica). We exchanged a few messages about this in the past and the matter has been hanging in the balance since then.

According to what we were taught in school, Bosnians were the good Slavs who opted for Islam as a community and gained our ancestors hearts. There has always been a good rapport between us and them. As fellow Muslims, they are entitled to our vote automatically whenever there is a conflict we side with them since the Serbs are considered as the bad guys whom we fought several times in history. Our history books were (in my school days) boastful of our great victories against the Serbs. This provides an excellent framework for a hostile regard of the Serbs complete with stereotypes and partiality. I would expect the story on the other end to be more or less the same. We share what is called a Balkan spirit with the Serbians. This so-called Balkan spirit has all the tones of fascistic and nationalistic feelings, a keen awareness of one´s ethnic roots, religious identity and an acute hatred for other Balkan nations.

Ironically, despite these sharp polarities of ethnicity and religion there is little difference in the way their cultures and perspectives about life. Having been raised in patriarchal families, they bow down to authority easily and get easily out of control when agitated or provoked. They are usually childish in their demeanors, you could find persons seriously defending Hitler or advocating a foolish opinion like why it is actually benign to butcher certain folks etc. Knowing my own culture, I know the other cultures too. Though most of this is essentially remains as the word of mouth, it does sound quite irritating to those who don´t know the culture.

Being the natural allies of the Bosnians we have always supported their story. The world was on our side at that particular moment. Yet, we might have missed certain points when we were focused on the sufferings of the Bosnians.

Would you tell us how you felt and what attrocities did you witness durin that dark episode in the Balkans. You don´t have to prove anything, just tell us about the pieces of truth that have never got through to us.

Well, we are getting quite a bit cryptic but anyway. I must set the record straight, I don´t want global cops or a new world order, all I am asking for is letting all nations determine their own fates and staying away from their borders unless there is an anonymously determined humanitarian ground.

Big brothers get out of our gardens and give peace a chance...

Anyone not getting this message, don´t worry, the world has always been the other way around and it seems it will remain that way.

We will sadly, remain as a few objectors whose voice is not heard.

Well, this is perfectly normal, there can always be multiple reactions, this is quite understandable. After all, what we have here are pretty much like Western and Eastern fan clubs. Both are very predictable. I would be surprized if  either group could ever show some sort of empathy. This is almost in their making, with all those stereotypes injected into their brains, all that they can do is producing these uniform sentences. Anyway, as we are talking Libya´s coffin is getting ready, another zombie republic will take its place. Its wealth will be distributed among Western investors and this way Sarko will not need to ask for money from Qaddafi for his next election campaign, nor will Britain have to look for Arab owners for their football clubs. The money is there to be taken.

I will not find anything wrong about you unless you sing the praises of these savage invasions. Stop intimidating the world with weapons and fire power. In the past, we lost almost half of our population to the vicious desires of the Western forces. We fought a war of independence to clear our country from those well-meant French, British and Greek invaders. We know how it feels that´s all. You should understand, the threat is always coming from the West who doesn´t want to let anyone hold on to the wealth of their own nations. 

So the question here is not you. It is just a general reaction. Enough is enough.

OK. If we go on here with this we will become off topic. We could move this to another thread and I will gladly discuss with you...

You are welcome to living in any country Stumpy. The poorer half of the world opens up its visa free borders to you. You can be anywhere, any time with all your complaints and disdain of local culture. You consider yourself as the norm. All the rest is wrong, there is no such thing like natural evolution, let´s wipe them out off the face of the Earth. The bombardment will tame the savages in Libya and convert them into a more civilized people. Don´t get surprized with this, if you compress the timeline a bit, this is more or less how the West has regarded Africa for centuries. This did not stop until after 50´s. Just listen to the memories of the Jazz singers. Even multitudes of Western red necks consider the catostrophy in Japan as yet another revenge of the attack on Pearl Harbour. What would you expect when their government has not officially apoligized to date.

When you take a look at how things are organized in today´s world, you´ll see wealth is controlled by the powers that be with the poverty becoming the fate for billions of people. Any attempt that might jeopardize the situation is punished with bombardments. 

When these poor and hopeless people show up at your gates, you point your fingers at them saying, "These people choose to live in our country because it is good." Yeah, it is good, about 32 million people living in a continent size territory with riches of all sorts captured from the natives. If I were you I would shut up and pray God for being so generous to me. These people are not coming to you because they are crazy for your culture, all that there is, is the usual thing between the haves and have nots.

Bydand, the newspapers ring today with the news that The Arab League has denounced the intervention on account that they are calling for the enforcement of a no-flight zone only; not a full scale bombing operation.

For your information, I am not a fanatic supporter of Qaddafi, I don´t like him even a bit. Nevertheless, I wouldn´t bomb his country without negotiating with him first. He is still the recognized leader of his country. Should he be subjected to sanctions, there are natural steps to follow. These might be economic and military sanctions. When these fail harsher measures could be considered and each one of these steps must be in accordance with the established international laws.

Of course, if you are content with a Wild West type general outlook in international relations, there is not much to be said. It is a bit good luck to be on the winning side. 

We humans have a high IQ but our animal instincts still linger on. Sometimes, we just can´t see the whole picture. We must have fair laws and practices in international politics; we must make sure that justice is served. War must be the last step not the first.

As for Canada sympathizing with the Libyan sufferings; well that sounds like one heck of a tall story. I would more readily believe Canada is siding with their natural allies in the hope of increasing its non-existing international influence.

Just out of curiousity, wasn´t there a seed of truth in the way Bosnians treated by the Serbs during the hostilities. Were the Serbs completely innocent? How did all those civilians lose their lives and how do you explain the mass burials uncovered in the aftermath of the war. 

I am not asking those to tease you or to challenge you, I understand Serbs have become a victim of the war eventually, but what about all those accusations of massacre and the stuff. Do you think they were all fabricated?

Meanwhile, that particular operation was probably the only one that did not involve an energy connection as well as being seemingly not an example of Christianity against Islam drive.