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Living - working in Turkey

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(34 Messages in 4 pages - View all)
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10.       deli
5904 posts
 17 Mar 2007 Sat 04:57 am

Vur abalıya! Jump on him while he´s down! (a reproach).

11.       metehan2001
501 posts
 17 Mar 2007 Sat 05:03 am

Quoting deli:

Vur abalıya! Jump on him while he´s down! (a reproach).


Thanks for such a quick translation, deli. As a Turkish man, I just felt so, when I have read the above posts. Do you think that making such a generalization can be true for men (Turkish, or whatever)?

12.       Trudy
7887 posts
 17 Mar 2007 Sat 10:55 am

Quoting metehan2001:

Do you think that making such a generalization can be true for men (Turkish, or whatever)?



Some men, yes, some women too. Not all. Is that what you want to hear?

13.       azade
1606 posts
 17 Mar 2007 Sat 02:36 pm

Quoting metehan2001:

Quoting deli:

Vur abalıya! Jump on him while he´s down! (a reproach).


Thanks for such a quick translation, deli. As a Turkish man, I just felt so, when I have read the above posts. Do you think that making such a generalization can be true for men (Turkish, or whatever)?



No it's certaintly not true for all turkish men - only for a very small percentage. However I do believe the initial post in this thread is true for a larger part of turkish men. Still not all, but some. Generalizations are unfortunately sometimes hard to avoid - didn't mean to offend anyone.

14.       robyn :D
2640 posts
 17 Mar 2007 Sat 04:32 pm

Quoting azade:

Quoting metehan2001:

Quoting deli:

Vur abalıya! Jump on him while he´s down! (a reproach).


Thanks for such a quick translation, deli. As a Turkish man, I just felt so, when I have read the above posts. Do you think that making such a generalization can be true for men (Turkish, or whatever)?



No it's certaintly not true for all turkish men - only for a very small percentage. However I do believe the initial post in this thread is true for a larger part of turkish men. Still not all, but some. Generalizations are unfortunately sometimes hard to avoid - didn't mean to offend anyone.



I'm with azade, the commnts were not supposed to offend anyone and it isn't just Turkish men but just some men in general.Sorry if anyone misunderstood or took offence it certainly wasn't meant, just observations from experience. Apologies once again

15.       CARTEL
63 posts
 17 Mar 2007 Sat 04:49 pm

Quoting metehan2001:

Quoting deli:

Vur abalıya! Jump on him while he´s down! (a reproach).


Thanks for such a quick translation, deli. As a Turkish man, I just felt so, when I have read the above posts. Do you think that making such a generalization can be true for men (Turkish, or whatever)?



metehan is right

16.       juliacernat
424 posts
 17 Mar 2007 Sat 04:59 pm

please find below the continuation of the article:


"[...] lots of people want to understand better what a healthy relationship should be like.
Correspondents are unsure whether a characteristic they see in their partner and do not like is “cultural” or a “personal trait.” This works both ways; sometimes they are a non-Turk with a Turkish loved one, sometimes vice versa.

Writer Hara Estroff Marano has researched many sources and questioned many experts on this subject, thus culling some basic relationship rules. I came across these recently and thought they would be very helpful. The first I want to share with you is what I might term a “Golden Rule.”

If you don’t understand or like something your partner is doing, ask about it and why he or she is doing it. Talk and explore, don’t assume.
Talking together about how such and such a behavior is surprising for you, is it normal in his/her culture, etc. can help solve many misunderstandings.

Another pearl of wisdom from Marano is:

Solve problems as they arise. Don’t let resentments simmer.

If you wait until you have a whole list of issues then you will probably be past solving them! Either you will be so angry that you cannot talk together calmly and respectfully, or the behavior/attitude will be so engrained the other will be unable to change.

And if the problem is not raised by you, but your partner raises a problem they have with you, what does Marano advise?

Listen, truly listen, to your partner’s concerns and complaints without judgment. Empathy is crucial. Look at things from your partner’s perspective as well as your own.

Here are a few more of Marano’s ideas: They are universal, but will be influenced by culture. I suggest you print these rules off and work through them.

Choose a partner wisely and well. Evaluate a potential partner as you would a friend -- look at their character, personality, values, their generosity of spirit, the relationship between their words and actions, their relationships with others.

Know your partner’s beliefs about relationships. Make sure your ideas don’t conflict.

Know your needs and speak up for them clearly. Closeness cannot occur without honesty. Your partner is not a mind reader.

Respect, respect, respect. Mutual respect is essential to a good relationship.

View yourselves as a team, which means you are two unique individuals bringing different perspectives and strengths. That is the value of a team: your differences.

Know how to manage differences; this is the key to success in a relationship.

Learn to negotiate. Modern relationships no longer rely on roles cast by culture.

Don’t rush things. If you need time to understand each other better, then take it. Far better to get married a few months later, totally sure you are committing yourself to the person you can love for the rest of your life, than to walk down the aisle quickly with your fingers crossed hoping for the best.

“The path of true love never did run smooth.” Working through issues will make you stronger people and enable your relationship to grow. If you genuinely love, you will trust!"


Charlotte McPherson, "He loves me....He loves me not...", Today's Zaman, 17.03.2007

17.       vineyards
1954 posts
 03 Apr 2007 Tue 05:48 pm

18.       catwoman
8933 posts
 03 Apr 2007 Tue 06:45 pm

Quoting vineyards:

Note: All "yous" in this post refer to the persons featured in the original article.

Turks are Turks and Brits are Brits. Not all Turks are like the rest of the Turks and the same goes for the Brits.
If she is not happy with her Turkish boyfriend, she might consider dropping him.

There is no reason for making unnecessary analogies such as mouse going on holiday and tasting pork for a change and metamorphosing into his old self on returning to his hometown. You are the one chasing the poor mouse from one corner to another and what you are going through is the frustration that happens when one realizes that there is not just one culture in the world and it is the wrongest thing to try to judge a culture through the perspective of another.

You may point out to greater personal freedoms in your culture, I could be boastful of the fact that people are less inclined to suicide or I'd praise virtues of the lower violent crime rate in this country. You could claim that women enjoy more freedom in your country and I could point out to the fact that they won the suffrage first in Turkey and I might also want to draw your attention to the ever strong porn industry in the civilized part of the world and to all forms of exploitation of the female body by way of soft porn and other erotic publications. I could criticize the Catholic mind set on account that it doesn't allow divorces or abortions. If I want to compare, I can come up with millions of other examples.

The punchlne is : set the mouse free.



Yet, I didn't think that anybody "judged" Turkish culture or said that one is better then the other. However, issues like double standards in areas that aren't so common for western societies is a good topic to talk about, don't you think? I get the impression that any kind of criticism or even a statement about the reality meets with a lot of offended feelings. Whoever posts something uncomfortable about Turkish culture has to quickly apologize...

19.       vineyards
1954 posts
 03 Apr 2007 Tue 07:32 pm

20.       Trudy
7887 posts
 03 Apr 2007 Tue 07:38 pm

Quoting vineyards:

Quoting juliacernat:



Your boyfriend is displaying a double standard: It was OK for you to go to this club to meet each other but not OK for you to go now. But it is more than just a double standard. Before, you were just “a girl.” What you did would not reflect on him or his family honor. Now you are “his girl,” and your behavior will affect the honor of all women in his family.

It seems to me you have some serious issues to think about before you jump into the relationship lock, stock and barrel.



Who is the author 'judging' in the above paragraphs and what does she base her argument on? Turks have one kind of family and that is conservative, is that right? Maybe this guy is a very jealous man belonging to a very modern family. Everyone is deemed innocent unless proven guilty.



Does the author say that this jealous and 'double standard' behaviour is typical Turkish or exclusively Turkish? I don't read that, she just says that (some) men behave like this. And I think she's right. So why this defensiveness, Vineyards? No one says you're such a man.

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