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Interent Porn ?????
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| 50. |
29 Jul 2008 Tue 11:55 pm |
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Quoting KeithL: I have found my fair share of woman |
And you said I was the ONLY one! 
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| 51. |
30 Jul 2008 Wed 12:24 am |
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Quoting catwoman: Quoting thehandsom: Your approach to this ´simple issue´ is ´not´ very positive and constructive..
I fear that with your approach, you will become a ´partnerless´ girl catwoman. 
Meltem´s approach was much better:
Let´s look at it the positive way. Now, you know your husband a little bit better
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Well.... it is true that it is hard to be a person who demands fairness in a world where it is institutionalized that men can exploit women freely. I may very well end up partnerless, but I assure you I won´t spend two nights crying about it! There is about 1,000 other things to enjoy in life other besides a partner. |
I can just see it now, catwoman at age 70. Alone with 100 cats in her apartment...watching Waltons porn. Don´t worry, I will call the police if you fail to log onto TC for a few days.
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| 52. |
30 Jul 2008 Wed 12:45 am |
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Quoting KeithL: I´m not going to argue for "or against" the merits of porn. But I think gereralizing about women´s attitudes on porn is similar to saying women don´t want sex as much as men. I have found my fair share of woman who have been far more "open-minded" in sex that I might be. I do believe there are women out there who do enjoy having their sex video-taped for the excitement (isn´t this porn?). But I do agree with you Catwoman that far too many wpmen in porn are probably in a horrible lifestyles, (drugs, prostitution, etc.)
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There are many different types of "porn" and definitions of exactly what it is. Remember, Henry Miller and others were banned in the US due to obscenity laws....so what are we really talking about?
This is the the definition according to WordNet Search - 3.0
"S: (n) pornography, porno, porn, erotica, smut (creative activity (writing or pictures or films etc.) of no literary or artistic value other than to stimulate sexual desire)"
Top 10 "Obscene" Literary Classics
Obscenity in Art Cannot Be Generalized
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| 53. |
30 Jul 2008 Wed 12:49 am |
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Quoting catwoman: -- first of all, porn does not spice up sex life. ok, maybe it does - in a similar way as alcohol, or cocaine may spice up a relationship. however, the alcohol - porn comparison is not quite accurate because men and women are not depicted the same way in porn. pornography depicts females in a degraded, submissive, dominated way and the females often suffer in porn - so that the male can have some sadistic ´fun´. females in porn don´t experience any pleasure, so to say that women like porn is like saying that women like to be raped and abused. no healthy woman would freely like to watch the mainstream porn. it is only about male fantasy of dominance and sexual abuse.
-- some women may watch porn, but the fact is that most women who do, report that they felt pressured and/or intimidated to do so. it is a fact that pornography leads to lower self-esteem, much more serious then usual body image problems, depression.
-- pornography does not exist in a vacuum and is not a product of people´s creativity. it is an industrial product, a product of misogyny and hatred of women. it is a disgusting and ugly expression of sexuality - sexuality where a woman is a piece of meat that the man can cum in the mouth of, can penetrate anally, can give her any amount of pain he wants. these men call women "three orifices" - that´s exactly what women mean to these men.
-- we live in a patriarchal, sexist culture, where women are not valued as full human beings, but mainly for their appearance. in this culture boys are socialized from a very early age to identify their sexuality with objectification of women. once you justify objectification (dehumanization), a lot of cruel and appalling products can be possible to watch and ´enjoy´. so a lot of ´normal´ men can watch porn and not be considered perverted or sick, because our culture accepts as normal at least some level of perversion and disrespecting female bodies.
-- it is wrong to say that pornography has no effect on a person. of course it does. there are countless of examples. it is not a sole factor, but it is a very big one. men who view pornography report that monogamous relationships are not normal or natural, they say that rape is not a crime, it is an acceptable act, they cease being satisfied with sex with a ´normal´ woman and it may even progress to not wanting any sex with a real person at all, it leads to sexual dysfunction... and many others.
-- i am not even going to get into the practices of the industry itself.... |
I think the concensious of opinion from the women here is that they are comfortable with porn. I agree than in some cases intimidation (into watching and performing)is a factor. But please dont tell me that the industry is full of women who are not enjoying what they are doing or what they are getting paid for doing it.
Anyone who is into drugs, sorry that is their problem and they need not get into the situation and resort to porn as a way out.
It would be quite interesting to know where your sources of research come from and who carried it out and what the methodology used, what the control group consisted of or cross section of women/men it was carried out on.
I don´t doubt that porn can be a factor in some rape cases or abuse in the home, but not all or even not most. I do think that the argument here is on the extreme and one that has been broached here before!
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| 54. |
30 Jul 2008 Wed 12:59 am |
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Quoting catwoman: -- first of all, porn does not spice up sex life. ok, maybe it does - in a similar way as alcohol, or cocaine may spice up a relationship. however, the alcohol - porn comparison is not quite accurate because......
.....
-- i am not even going to get into the practices of the industry itself.... |
I think you´re right about porn. Watching porn might be harmful to any one watching it, men or women. Women as well who watch it can regard their own body differently, and feel themselves somehow inferior, and like a sex object day by day. Porn material is so available, so anyone who is interested in it, should try to make personal decisions, for not even starting to watch it, because it may become addictive VERY EASILY. Here determination is important especially for men, but they are not even very aware of its harm.
I have personally known a well educated guy with a good profession, who told me he watches it regularly (like everyday), he just cannot stop himself from watching it, but after everytime he watched, he told me he felt guilty about it, but the guiltiness he felt could not overcome the attractiveness of the very available porn in his pc.
And starting from very innocent material, you can get to very violent porn step by step, to incest and to rape materials. Like increasing the dose of your drug.
BTW, I read your post catwoman to a good friend of me aged 21 that I consider like brother who I know watches porn as well (there are so many!), I read your post to him, and he told me "I want to see research papers, I just believe in research papers!" because he´s a scienist-to-be.
I know myself very well that watching porn is a bad habit, no one can claim that it´s a good thing. Just because you enjoy something does not make it a good thing for you.
I adviced to the girl not to make too much pressure on her husband, because I don´t think it will help a lot. It may not be a very bad case either. So, just talking to him in a cool way, and asking him not to try to hide it if he´s going to watch it again because I doubt if he will immediately stop it. If she gets mad at him, he will do it in one way or another.
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| 55. |
30 Jul 2008 Wed 09:12 am |
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I have no idea where you took those ideas from, Cat, but they are oversimplified. First of all, let´s separate the legal porn industry and illegal one that´s often connected to human trafficking and drugs. I won´t spend a minute analysing the latter as I´m obviously against it (exactly like any kind of violation of human rights and personal freedom). However, in the former kind, none of the things you mentioned hold.
What gives you the idea that porns are about male domination? There are as many porn films about female domination as well - the idea is different people like different things, some guys want to dominate, some like being dominated. And, following the marketing rule that demand creates supply, both sides are provided for. Also, do notice that your bedroom life does not always reflect your daily life - many successful people love being dominated in the privacy of their house while they´d never let anyone dominate them outside it.
Women in porn films are not forced to choose this career, it is their conscious choice and their way of making money - it is legal so how can you tell them they are being discriminated here? Porn stars make lots of money, they money they´d never make working as check-out girls in Wal-mart. When they retire, they start their own porn business - like production companies etc. Actually they fall in the category of female entrepreneurs that we should look up to and, into the category of successful working women. Sure it´s not the case with every porn actress but there´s been quite a few who did it.
A long time ago I watched a tv documentary about porn business in Poland, to my greatest surprise women in this industry get paid about three times more than men. Where´s the inequality there?
As for taking pleasure from what they do - do you think a woman in a production line putting cans to boxes gets aroused by that? Do you think she finds it orgasmic? It is just a job. Some like it more, some don´t.
Also, it´s quite unfair to say no normal woman would watch porn with violence, rape or the like. Does it mean no normal person watches horror films? Actually normal (whatever that means) people know the difference between films and reality. I don´t know any people addicted to porn although I could bet 80% of my friends have seen at least one porn in their lives. I know couples who watch porns just to have fun - not because they have to but because they want to fool around and you can´t tell them it´s sick - it is unacceptable for you and that´s fine.
The alcohol example is not missed. I have already stated that not all women are abused in the porn industry, which makes alcohol, porns and drugs the same. For some people it´s fun, for others it isn´t. Yet, all of those may be a danger if they become too often present in one´s life.
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| 56. |
30 Jul 2008 Wed 11:10 am |
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Quoting Daydreamer:
A long time ago I watched a tv documentary about porn business in Poland, to my greatest surprise women in this industry get paid about three times more than men. Where´s the inequality there?
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To your greatest surprise? Don´t you know that there´re millions of men who would do it for free? Just give an announce in Turkey looking for unpaid male porn stars. You´d be amazed.
Finding a woman who will be willing to be degraded and treated as a sex object is much more difficult.
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| 57. |
30 Jul 2008 Wed 11:25 am |
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But I think it´s harder for a man to keep up the standards in porn films than for a woman, after all it seems quite a hard job and, let´s be honest, not many men can meet porn-star criteria in the real life
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| 58. |
30 Jul 2008 Wed 11:46 am |
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Quoting Daydreamer: But I think it´s harder for a man to keep up the standards in porn films than for a woman, after all it seems quite a hard job and, let´s be honest, not many men can meet porn-star criteria in the real life |
I don´t know which criterias you talk about because I´m not very familiar with the industry itself, but you know there´re some drugs that help you keep up with the standards.  and most stars use them I guess.
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| 59. |
30 Jul 2008 Wed 11:52 am |
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Quoting AEnigmamagnadea: Quoting KeithL: I have found my fair share of woman |
And you said I was the ONLY one! |
I said I found them. I didn´t keep them....
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| 60. |
30 Jul 2008 Wed 05:29 pm |
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Quoting Daydreamer: I have no idea where you took those ideas from, Cat, but they are oversimplified. First of all, let´s separate the legal porn industry and illegal one that´s often connected to human trafficking and drugs. I won´t spend a minute analysing the latter as I´m obviously against it (exactly like any kind of violation of human rights and personal freedom). However, in the former kind, none of the things you mentioned hold.
What gives you the idea that porns are about male domination? There are as many porn films about female domination as well - the idea is different people like different things, some guys want to dominate, some like being dominated. And, following the marketing rule that demand creates supply, both sides are provided for. Also, do notice that your bedroom life does not always reflect your daily life - many successful people love being dominated in the privacy of their house while they´d never let anyone dominate them outside it.
Women in porn films are not forced to choose this career, it is their conscious choice and their way of making money - it is legal so how can you tell them they are being discriminated here? Porn stars make lots of money, they money they´d never make working as check-out girls in Wal-mart. When they retire, they start their own porn business - like production companies etc. Actually they fall in the category of female entrepreneurs that we should look up to and, into the category of successful working women. Sure it´s not the case with every porn actress but there´s been quite a few who did it.
A long time ago I watched a tv documentary about porn business in Poland, to my greatest surprise women in this industry get paid about three times more than men. Where´s the inequality there?
As for taking pleasure from what they do - do you think a woman in a production line putting cans to boxes gets aroused by that? Do you think she finds it orgasmic? It is just a job. Some like it more, some don´t.
Also, it´s quite unfair to say no normal woman would watch porn with violence, rape or the like. Does it mean no normal person watches horror films? Actually normal (whatever that means) people know the difference between films and reality. I don´t know any people addicted to porn although I could bet 80% of my friends have seen at least one porn in their lives. I know couples who watch porns just to have fun - not because they have to but because they want to fool around and you can´t tell them it´s sick - it is unacceptable for you and that´s fine.
The alcohol example is not missed. I have already stated that not all women are abused in the porn industry, which makes alcohol, porns and drugs the same. For some people it´s fun, for others it isn´t. Yet, all of those may be a danger if they become too often present in one´s life. |
You have LOTS and LOTS of misconceptions here DD. You basically have not looked at this subject closer, you just have detached mainstream, abstract ideas about it. I will get back with you soon.
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