Turkey |
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headscarf was still a social problem
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| 100. |
10 Jan 2008 Thu 02:44 pm |
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Quoting thehandsom: Quoting Waseem_UK: Quoting thehandsom: Quoting zbrct:
Really...? So what about those Turkish citizen girls who want to study and work with their head scarfs?
Oh ok, I understand now. We want freedoom just for ourselves...But that is not sincere...
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Well..I already told above that turban ban in universities should be removed. And about the work. what about the private sector? I already told that the STATE should have equal distance to all its citizens. It is the reason any statement relating to religionS should not not be allowed..
I would not want a monk in orange dress as a teacher for example..
would you? |
As long as the monk in orange dress is qualified to teach the subject, I don't mind. I don't look at the appearance of my teachers, only the ability and quality. |
Well.. Most of the muslim parents wont like a teacher wearing priest costume and a huge cross neckles..
wont you mind yourself for example?
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Do I need to repeat myself?
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| 101. |
10 Jan 2008 Thu 02:51 pm |
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Quoting Waseem_UK: Quoting thehandsom: Quoting Waseem_UK: Quoting thehandsom: Quoting zbrct:
Really...? So what about those Turkish citizen girls who want to study and work with their head scarfs?
Oh ok, I understand now. We want freedoom just for ourselves...But that is not sincere...
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Well..I already told above that turban ban in universities should be removed. And about the work. what about the private sector? I already told that the STATE should have equal distance to all its citizens. It is the reason any statement relating to religionS should not not be allowed..
I would not want a monk in orange dress as a teacher for example..
would you? |
As long as the monk in orange dress is qualified to teach the subject, I don't mind. I don't look at the appearance of my teachers, only the ability and quality. |
Well.. Most of the muslim parents wont like a teacher wearing priest costume and a huge cross neckles..
wont you mind yourself for example?
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Do I need to repeat myself? |
Well you dont need to.. If you really do not have issues with that well done!! But many many muslim families will object..I will Object too
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| 102. |
10 Jan 2008 Thu 03:07 pm |
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Hmmmmm.
In London, a lot of muslim parents send their daughters to all-girls schools run by the Catholic church or the Church of England, because the schools have a good academic record, and also because there are no boys. e.g. the Virgo Fidelis school 2 minutes from my mum's home has a lot of Pakistani students, and St. Martin-in-the-Fields (my old school) has a lot of Nigerian students.
In actual fact, when I was there one girl in my class was Turkish, and another was Egyptian.
Does this mean muslims in London are more tolerant than secular Turks in Turkey? Ouch.
I am a Christian, and have had some wonderful teachers who are Jews, Buddhists, total atheists, and yes of course Muslim. My first primary school teacher was Mrs Mirza from Pakistan. She wore shalvar-kamiz and a head covering. I remember Mrs Sheikh (married to an Arab), and Mr Helowitz (Polish Jew), and Miss Meliniotis (Greek Orthodox) as well as "religion is the opium of the people" being one of the favourite phrases of Mrs Marsden. I didn't see any difference between them and Miss Martin who was a deacon in the anglican church, or Mrs Drey who was married to a Baptist minister. None of them treated me any differently, or gave me better or worse marks because of religion. The only thing that mattered to me was whether they were good or bad teachers.
A multi-cultural education is really nothing to be scared of, it adds breadth and depth to your life-experience, and to your personality I think.
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| 103. |
10 Jan 2008 Thu 03:11 pm |
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I totally agree with you, Marion. Very well formulated!
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| 104. |
10 Jan 2008 Thu 03:13 pm |
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Quoting Waseem_UK: Quoting thehandsom: Quoting Waseem_UK: Quoting thehandsom: Quoting zbrct:
Really...? So what about those Turkish citizen girls who want to study and work with their head scarfs?
Oh ok, I understand now. We want freedoom just for ourselves...But that is not sincere...
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Well..I already told above that turban ban in universities should be removed. And about the work. what about the private sector? I already told that the STATE should have equal distance to all its citizens. It is the reason any statement relating to religionS should not not be allowed..
I would not want a monk in orange dress as a teacher for example..
would you? |
As long as the monk in orange dress is qualified to teach the subject, I don't mind. I don't look at the appearance of my teachers, only the ability and quality. |
Well.. Most of the muslim parents wont like a teacher wearing priest costume and a huge cross neckles..
wont you mind yourself for example?
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Do I need to repeat myself? |
Hi Waseem - he does have a point though here. Most difficulties appear to come from muslim sectors not wishing to intigrate - probably UK is a better example of this rather than Turkey. It genuinely seems far easier here than it does in the UK.
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| 105. |
10 Jan 2008 Thu 03:14 pm |
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Quoting MarioninTurkey: Hmmmmm.
In London, a lot of muslim parents send their daughters to all-girls schools run by the Catholic church or the Church of England, because the schools have a good academic record, and also because there are no boys. e.g. the Virgo Fidelis school 2 minutes from my mum's home has a lot of Pakistani students, and St. Martin-in-the-Fields (my old school) has a lot of Nigerian students.
In actual fact, when I was there one girl in my class was Turkish, and another was Egyptian.
Does this mean muslims in London are more tolerant than secular Turks in Turkey? Ouch.
I am a Christian, and have had some wonderful teachers who are Jews, Buddhists, total atheists, and yes of course Muslim. My first primary school teacher was Mrs Mirza from Pakistan. She wore shalvar-kamiz and a head covering. I remember Mrs Sheikh (married to an Arab), and Mr Helowitz (Polish Jew), and Miss Meliniotis (Greek Orthodox) as well as "religion is the opium of the people" being one of the favourite phrases of Mrs Marsden. I didn't see any difference between them and Miss Martin who was a deacon in the anglican church, or Mrs Drey who was married to a Baptist minister. None of them treated me any differently, or gave me better or worse marks because of religion. The only thing that mattered to me was whether they were good or bad teachers.
A multi-cultural education is really nothing to be scared of, it adds breadth and depth to your life-experience, and to your personality I think.
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Totally agree Marion, I think it can only be a good thing to experience as many different cultures as possible. And way to go your school(s) for employing such a diverse bunch!! On the other hand i also believe that religious schools should be allowed to remain. I do not believe in getting rid of them all together because there will be those parents who will only ever want to send their child to a religious school and i don't have a problem with that, they should have that choice. Oh and maybe they would like to consult the child as well!!
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| 106. |
10 Jan 2008 Thu 03:27 pm |
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Quoting Cacık:
Hi Waseem - he does have a point though here. Most difficulties appear to come from muslim sectors not wishing to intigrate - probably UK is a better example of this rather than Turkey. It genuinely seems far easier here than it does in the UK. |
Hi Cacik, I'm sure he has a point. But I don't understand what "genuinely seems far easier here than it does in the UK"?
Are we talking about tolerance and secularism in the UK now or Turkey?
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| 107. |
10 Jan 2008 Thu 03:55 pm |
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Quoting MarioninTurkey: Hmmmmm.
In London, a lot of muslim parents send their daughters to all-girls schools run by the Catholic church or the Church of England, because the schools have a good academic record, and also because there are no boys. e.g. the Virgo Fidelis school 2 minutes from my mum's home has a lot of Pakistani students, and St. Martin-in-the-Fields (my old school) has a lot of Nigerian students.
In actual fact, when I was there one girl in my class was Turkish, and another was Egyptian.
Does this mean muslims in London are more tolerant than secular Turks in Turkey? Ouch.
I am a Christian, and have had some wonderful teachers who are Jews, Buddhists, total atheists, and yes of course Muslim. My first primary school teacher was Mrs Mirza from Pakistan. She wore shalvar-kamiz and a head covering. I remember Mrs Sheikh (married to an Arab), and Mr Helowitz (Polish Jew), and Miss Meliniotis (Greek Orthodox) as well as "religion is the opium of the people" being one of the favourite phrases of Mrs Marsden. I didn't see any difference between them and Miss Martin who was a deacon in the anglican church, or Mrs Drey who was married to a Baptist minister. None of them treated me any differently, or gave me better or worse marks because of religion. The only thing that mattered to me was whether they were good or bad teachers.
A multi-cultural education is really nothing to be scared of, it adds breadth and depth to your life-experience, and to your personality I think.
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I totaly agree with what you are saying Marion..
BUT
Do you really think a teacher in Turkey wearing a turban will say "religion is the opium of the people"? Or even allow her pupils to talk about Darwin? Or talk about other religions?
I dont know every single school in the UK of course, but when they study 'religions' as a subject here, one week they study islam, next week they study hinduism, christianity etc. can you see anything like that in Turkish schools? They teach how to pray namaz straight away!!
I have had some jews friends an Uni..One of them was saying that he was so scared to say that he was a jew for example.
I sincerely believe that turban problem in Turkey is nothing to do with freedom..It is something to do with the desire to convert the society into Sheria. And it is not me being paranoid..
And I am totaly against the Sheria!!
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| 108. |
10 Jan 2008 Thu 03:59 pm |
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Quoting Waseem_UK: Quoting Cacık:
Hi Waseem - he does have a point though here. Most difficulties appear to come from muslim sectors not wishing to intigrate - probably UK is a better example of this rather than Turkey. It genuinely seems far easier here than it does in the UK. |
Hi Cacik, I'm sure he has a point. But I don't understand what "genuinely seems far easier here than it does in the UK"?
Are we talking about tolerance and secularism in the UK now or Turkey? |
Hi there Waseem - sorry not to be clear, I was only making an observation or thinking aloud as it were ! I mean that I find there less of a problem in society in Turkey about the topic than in the public in the UK. Hold on - I am kand of busy right now, can I carry on a bit later on ?
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| 109. |
10 Jan 2008 Thu 04:00 pm |
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thats such an easy to blame others to be with somethings about their preferences and thats such a big mistake to see theirself once owner of all system??
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| 110. |
10 Jan 2008 Thu 04:03 pm |
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Quoting MrX67: thats such an easy to blame others to be with somethings about their preferences and thats such a big mistake to see theirself once owner of all system?? |
Well..
The system I am trying to defend here is democracy..And it should owned by everybody.
But I cant say the same thing for Sheria.
Sheria is not democratic AT ALL.
Dont you agree?
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