Strange text. Do you mean that people who visit Turkey (on regular base or not) or who plan to do that cannot critisize the country?

While I don´t want to label the person who started this thread (since I can´t understand what he really means) but what he wrote calls to mind a few thoughts not necessarily relevant to this person.

 

There are indeed a few schools of thought in Turkey producing millions of pre-formatted minds capable of only producing one sort of mentalily. These people have a problem with Western values although they have no problem enjoying the positive aspects of it.  With their minds narrowed down to running around  a few iron-clad cliches they are quick to answer criticisim and stay afloat no matter how deep the quagmire of their ignorance is.  Anyone only  capable of producing a colored bearing the signatures of a certain subculture  or a certain restrictive ideology at the expense of reason and universal truth  is nothing more than a miserable person.

 

You can use many arguments to blame the West today. The most striking examples being the newly revealed evidence of large scale torture in Guantanamo and two other US camps. You could point out to the crimes committed by the Bush administration. You could recall what Kennedy said about secret organizations within society and use these as excuses to position yourself as an enemy of the West. 

 

At the end of the day, there are so many bad things about the West but essentially, there are a lot more good things that came from it.  Our own culture is a product of the thousands of years of interaction between both West and East. 

 

I see nothing wrong in having an idea different from all others´. This is actually a sign of a creative mind. I sometimes wish all those Armenians and Greeks to visit Turkey once in a while. This way, I believe many of the stereotypes about Turkey will be shattered. I also wish a greater number of Turkish people could freely travel around the world which will help them broaden their visions.

 

Last but not least, we don´t need enemies, we need friends...

While I don´t want to label the person who started this thread (since I can´t understand what he really means) but what he wrote calls to mind a few thoughts not necessarily relevant to this person.

 

There are indeed a few schools of thought in Turkey producing millions of pre-formatted minds capable of only producing one sort of mentalily. These people have a problem with Western values although they have no problem enjoying the positive aspects of it.  With their minds narrowed down to running around  a few iron-clad cliches they are quick to answer criticisim and stay afloat no matter how deep the quagmire of their ignorance is.  Anyone only  capable of producing a colored bearing the signatures of a certain subculture  or a certain restrictive ideology at the expense of reason and universal truth  is nothing more than a miserable person.

 

You can use many arguments to blame the West today. The most striking examples being the newly revealed evidence of large scale torture in Guantanamo and two other US camps. You could point out to the crimes committed by the Bush administration. You could recall what Kennedy said about secret organizations within society and use these as excuses to position yourself as an enemy of the West. 

 

At the end of the day, there are so many bad things about the West but essentially, there are a lot more good things that came from it.  Our own culture is a product of the thousands of years of interaction between both West and East. 

 

I see nothing wrong in having an idea different from all others´. This is actually a sign of a creative mind. I sometimes wish all those Armenians and Greeks to visit Turkey once in a while. This way, I believe many of the stereotypes about Turkey will be shattered. I also wish a greater number of Turkish people could freely travel around the world which will help them broaden their visions.

 

Last but not least, we don´t need enemies, we need friends...

Strange text. Do you mean that people who visit Turkey (on regular base or not) or who plan to do that cannot critisize the country?

 

 

I think he´s saying that we must ´call a terrorist a terrorist´ or we shouldn´t learn Turkish or be a member of Turkish Class or visit Turkey.

 

I was about to say ´Welcome to Turkish Class´ oscarray - but I see you have been a member for over 2 years.  I wonder what prompted you to post in the forum after all this time?

While I don´t want to label the person who started this thread (since I can´t understand what he really means) but what he wrote calls to mind a few thoughts not necessarily relevant to this person.

 

There are indeed a few schools of thought in Turkey producing millions of pre-formatted minds capable of only producing one sort of mentalily. These people have a problem with Western values although they have no problem enjoying the positive aspects of it.  With their minds narrowed down to running around  a few iron-clad cliches they are quick to answer criticisim and stay afloat no matter how deep the quagmire of their ignorance is.  Anyone only  capable of producing a colored thought bearing the signatures of a certain subculture  or a certain restrictive ideology at the expense of reason and universal truth  is nothing more than a miserable person.

 

You can use many arguments to blame the West today. The most striking examples being the newly revealed evidence of large scale torture in Guantanamo and two other US camps. You could point out to the crimes committed by the Bush administration. You could recall what Kennedy said about secret organizations within society and use these as excuses to position yourself as an enemy of the West. 

 

At the end of the day, there are so many bad things about the West but essentially, there are a lot more good things that came from it.  Our own culture is a product of the thousands of years of interaction between both West and East. 

 

I see nothing wrong in having an idea different from all others´. This is actually a sign of a creative mind. I sometimes wish all those Armenians and Greeks to visit Turkey once in a while. This way, I believe many of the stereotypes about Turkey will be shattered. I also wish a greater number of Turkish people could freely travel around the world which will help them broaden their visions.

 

Last but not least, we don´t need enemies, we need friends...

While I don´t want to label the person who started this thread (since I can´t understand what he really means) but what he wrote calls to mind a few thoughts not necessarily relevant to this person.

 

There are indeed a few schools of thought in Turkey producing millions of pre-formatted minds capable of only producing one sort of mentalily. These people have a problem with Western values although they have no problem enjoying the positive aspects of it.  With their minds narrowed down to running around  a few iron-clad cliches they are quick to answer criticisim and stay afloat no matter how deep the quagmire of their ignorance is.  Anyone only  capable of producing a colored thought bearing the signatures of a certain subculture  or a certain restrictive ideology at the expense of reason and universal truth  is nothing more than a miserable person.

 

You can use many arguments to blame the West today. The most striking examples being the newly revealed evidence of large scale torture in Guantanamo and two other US camps. You could point out to the crimes committed by the Bush administration. You could recall what Kennedy said about secret organizations within society and use these as excuses to position yourself as an enemy of the West. 

 

At the end of the day, there are so many bad things about the West but essentially, there are a lot more good things that came from it.  Our own culture is a product of the thousands of years of interaction between both West and East. 

 

I see nothing wrong in having an idea different from all others´. This is actually a sign of a creative mind. I sometimes wish all those Armenians and Greeks to visit Turkey once in a while. This way, I believe many of the stereotypes about Turkey will be shattered. I also wish a greater number of Turkish people could freely travel around the world which will help them broaden their visions.

 

Last but not least, we don´t need enemies, we need friends...

 

 

 I just highlighted a few sentences I agree completely. I hope too Turkish people can travel more like others can, not only to broaden their views but also - like many westerners do - for fun. And vineyards, let´s start critisizing......

I´m not sure what the original post has to do with the west.  I guess I took it to mean that you don´t belong here if you support the PKK a terrorist organization.   If I remember correctly most countries have skeltons in their closets including Turkey.  What if I was Armenian and wanted restitution, would I also be unwelcomed here?  I think I already know the answer..

 

 

and i highlighted the words i agree..

 

 

  No matter if you are Armenian,american,german..important is : do you want  turkish people killed?do you know the answer?

 

  I bet I have  been to more countries than you have been...we can critisize turkey, this is ok.. but we can not say PKK should kill turkish.do you say that? if it is your critisizing??? that kind of people should be away of TUrkey..

 

 

 

 I think everyone has a right to defend themselves.  However, with that being said I wish no harm to anyone based on their ethnic origin.  For the record, I do not support any terrorists organization.

 

 

   you are 100% did not understand the subject. http://www.nuveforum.net/939-siyaset-gundem/43870-pkknin-gercek-yuzu/ look that pictures and tell me if you do you love turkey or not ?????

 Tell me, should anyone join to this site if he/she thinks PKK is a good  group ? do you need to be a turk to call PKK as terrorist group ? does anyone have the right to kill people?

 

 

and i highlighted the words i agree..

 

 

  No matter if you are Armenian,american,german..important is : do you want  turkish people killed?do you know the answer?

 ....   you are 100% did not understand the subject.  Tell me, should anyone join to this site if he/she thinks PKK is a good  group ? do you need to be a turk to call PKK as terrorist group ? does anyone have the right to kill people?

 

 

 Have you read the Site Terms and Conditions (Forum Rules)?  Here are Rules 13 and 14

 

13. Posts supporting/sympathising with PKK or any other terrorist organization are forbidden. Such posts and their owners may be deleted from the site.

14. Since PKK is a very sensitive topic, discussion of PKK in the forums is limited only to (i) reporting news about a terrorist attack or (ii) reporting a government decision related to PKK. Even these, and related comments may be removed by an administrator or moderator based on personal judgement.

                                                                               -------------

The subject of various members complaining about other members allegedly ´supporting´ PKK because of their lack of complete condemnation has come up in many different threads over the past two years since you joined but you have never  commented before.  I´m wondering what your agenda is in trying to stir up feelings yet again?  Personally I don´t support PKK any more than I supported the IRA when they were bombing our cities and killing women and children but if I did I certainly wouldn´t get into an argument about it on a public forum.  What I would like to do is to offer my sincere condolences to the families of the 6 soldiers killed by a remote-controlled mine blast which hit a military vehicle in Hakkari on Wednesday night.

 

 

 

 

 

 

    I wish everybody  could offer his/her sincere condolences to the families of the 6 soldiers killed by a remote -controlled mine by PKK.The mean aim of this site is, to get together with people who loves turkey,turkish, and want to know more.Tell me, WHAT can be reason to join this site for someone who is supporting PKK? this is why this subject is stared.I think we should delete that kind of people from this site.Why someone wants to visit a country she/he hates?why someone wants to learn turkish she/he hates of turkey?This site is for the love of the Turkey..this is not a place to make people angry and to tell them how nice PKK, how smart man OCALAN ( a kind of animal in the world)

once agian, we have to get rid of people who  support PKK.this site is not for them.

 

 

 And you are the person to decide? I thought admins and mods were doing that.

 

 

   Are you not sorry about killed 6 turkish?DO you need help to make decision that you are sorry?I wish.I dont make decision.´What is meaning of ´´wish´´ ok, you,dont be sorry about Turkey..

 

 

    I wish everybody  could offer his/her sincere condolences to the families of the 6 soldiers killed by a remote -controlled mine by PKK.The mean aim of this site is, to get together with people who loves turkey,turkish, and want to know more.Tell me, WHAT can be reason to join this site for someone who is supporting PKK? this is why this subject is stared.I think we should delete that kind of people from this site.Why someone wants to visit a country she/he hates?why someone wants to learn turkish she/he hates of turkey?This site is for the love of the Turkey..this is not a place to make people angry and to tell them how nice PKK, how smart man OCALAN ( a kind of animal in the world)

once agian, we have to get rid of people who  support PKK.this site is not for them.

 

 

 I left to cook some supper - in that short time (about 15 minutes) may I congratulate you on the fact that your English has improved a hundredfold!

 

 

Blimey-what did you cook in 15mins!!

 

 

 I left to cook some supper - in that short time (about 15 minutes) may I congratulate you on the fact that your English has improved a hundredfold!

 

 

 A mushroom and cheese omelette - problem var?

 

 

  no , you can not..you are not my english teacher.you dont have any idea about my english..and here, the important is TURKish.this is turkishclass.right?I hope your supper was delicious even for so short time..

< cut>

 

 

 

 I bet everyone who reads your texts has an idea.....

 

 

 Really!!! does everyone have an idea of your english?your turksih? your personality? who knows your brain? my brain..etc?

Amerika Birleþik  Devletleri Baþkaný Obama, geçen ay Türkiye’yi ziyaret etmiþtir.

Türkiye Cumhuriyeti Cumhurbaþkaný Gül, oscarray’ nýn kýsmen de olsa dile getirdiði konularda, Obama’ya þunlarý söylemiþtir.

(Bu konuþma metni,  Dünya Medyasý’nda aynen yer almýþ ve Dünya Kamuoyu’ na yansýtýlmýþtýr.)

 

“Bu konuda ben de fikirlerimi paylaþmak istiyorum.Bu konu tabii çok tartýþýlan bir konu.Ama bu konu, bir hukuki ve siyasi konu deðil.Bahsedilen konu tarihi bir olaydýr.

1915 yýlýnda yaþanmýþ.Birinci Dünya Harbi (1914-18) þartlarýnda, dört cephede o günkü Osmanlý Ýmparatorluðu çarpýþýrken, maalesef kendi ülkesindeki bazý Osmanlý vatandaþlarý, BAZI ÜLKELER tarafýndan çok provoke edilmiþ.

Sonunda birçok iç çatýþmalar olmuþ ve birçok kiþi hayatýný kaybetmiþ.

Hayatýný kaybeden herkesin tabii ki acýsýný paylaþýyoruz.

Ama bilin ki ayný zamanda Türkler, Müslüman nüfus da  büyük bir kayba uðramýþtýr.

Ve yine  o dönemlerde Balkanlar’dan ve Kafkaslar’dan milyonlarca müslüman, Türk nüfus yerlerinden göçe mecbur edilmiþ ve Türkiye’ye gelirken çok büyük kayýplar olmuþtur.

Dolayýsýyla bütün bunlar o zamanýn, o savaþ ve kargaþa ortamý içerisinde yaþanan olaylardýr.

Ama modern Türkiye Cumhuriyeti kurulunca, yeni nesilleri nefret duygusuyla beslememek için, Türkiye bunlarý  dünyada büyük olay yapmamýþtýr.

Ama daha sonra maalesef, siyasi amaçlý olarak bu konular, dünyada, özellikle diasporanýn kendi kimliðini korumasý amacýyla çok gündeme getirilmiþtir.

Bu noktaya gelince bizim teklifimiz þu olmuþtur.

O zaman buyurun: tarihçiler, bu iþin uzmanlarý otursunlar ve bu konuyu çözsünler; biz yüzleþmeye hazýrýz.

Buna siyasetçiler ve hukukçular karar veremez ki.

Yani ne zaman oldu, nasýl oldu, hangi þartlar altýnda oldu, kim daha çok kaybetti, kim haklý, kim haksýz.

Buna bir parlamenter ve bir siyasetçi, iþin iç yüzünü bilmeden  nasýl karar verecek?

Onun için, “Gelin o zaman, ortak bir tarih komisyonu kurulsun ve komisyon neye karar verirse buna razýyýz” dedik.

Biz bunun için Türiye’nin bütün arþivlerini sonuna kadar açtýk ve bu arþivlere, Ermeniler baþta olmak üzere herkesi çaðýrdýk.

Bir adým daha  atýp þunu söyledik.

“Buna eðer herhangi bir ülke, (mesela Amerika Birleþik Devletleri, mesela Fransa), çok ilgi gösteriyorsa, bu ortak tarih komisyonuna onlar da girebilirler.Ve çýkacak neticeye hazýrýz” dedik.”

 

Bu metin, Türkiye’nin görüþüdür.

Türkiye Cumhurbaþkaný bu konuþmasýyla, Balkan, Kafkas ve Kýrým Türklerinin yaþadýðý dramý ilk defa dünya gündemine getirmiþtir.

Bu drama, bir de, Birinci Dünya Savaþý  sonrasýnda, Türkiye’nin, bazý BATILI DEVLETLER tarafýndan iþgal edilmesiyle birlikte uðradýðý mezalimi eklemek gerekir.

Oysa Türkler, bu mezalimler sonucunda, Balkanlar’da, Orta Doðu’da, Kýrým’da, Kafkaslar’da ve kendi Anayurdu’nda kaybettikleri insanlar için aðýt yakmadýðý için, o trajediler hiçbir zaman dünyanýn gündemine gelmedi.

(Herkesin bildiði gibi, Türkiye üzerinde, maalesef bugün de bazý þer odaklarýnca ayný ve benzer oyunlar oynanmak istenmektedir.)

Ve Türkler, göçe zorlandýklarý ülkeler için hiçbir zaman düþmanlýk beslemedi.

Türk Halký’nýn her ailesinde, bu mezalimlerin acý bir hatýrasý bugün de yaþar.

Ama herkesin Türklerden özür beklediði þu dönemde, Türklerin, mezalime uðramýþ atalarý için, o ÜLKELERden  özür dileme hakký vardýr.

Bu konuda, Amerikalý tanýnmýþ tarihçi Justin McCarty, diðer bazý Amerikalý, Rus, Ýngiliz ve  Fransýz tarihçilerin kitaplarýný okumanýzý tavsiye ederim.

Tarih gerçekleri söyler.

   

Not= Kendilerinden rica edilirse, MarioninTurkey, dilliduduk, insallah gibi TLC ‘deki tecrübeli arkadaþlar , bu yazýyý Ýngilizceye çevirebilir.

 

Not= Kendilerinden rica edilirse, MarioninTurkey, dilliduduk, insallah gibi TLC ‘deki tecrübeli arkadaþlar , bu yazýyý Ýngilizceye çevirebilir.

 

 

 

 Yep, at least they think they do.

 

 

 Sorry, I forgot, you are so famous.everybody knows you know the best english, best turkish..everybody knows your personality..etc.sorry famous user.

 

 

 Sorry, I forgot, you are so famous.everybody knows you know the best english, best turkish..everybody knows your personality..etc.sorry famous user.

 

 

 Hey, I object I thought I was the most famous....

 

 

 Hey, I object I thought I was the most famous....

 

 

Sorry-who are you again?

 

 

Sorry-who are you again?

 

 

 Nope you´re only the most famous bed amerikan!

 

 

 Oh, I like that title. 

 

 

 For everyone to know: FBA is referring to Teas, not to some obscure gang......

 

 

I´m sure Trudy is gracious enough to accept your apology.

A foreign person visiting this site for the love of our country or for any other reason cannot be expected or forced to share the grief of the loss of Turkish soldiers.  I can´t be expected to sympathize with the loss of American personnel in Iraq. Everyone shares the basic notion that it is a very bad experience to lose someone and if the closer that person to you, the bigger your grief gets.

 

Death is a reality of our lives. We are also bound to die someday. As the citizens of this country, we feel grieved when we lose soldiers in operations and this grief concerns only us. All the rest of the world, share little interest with us in regards of military matters. Therefore, they can hardly feel particularly sorry about our loss. It is not a good idea to share this grief with foreigners who have nothing to do with the conflict.

 

Should there be a relation, it is only on the international relations level and concerns politicians and statesmen and not necessarily ordinary citizens.

 

As a Turk who lost some members of his family to seperatist terror, I feel grieved about any life that is  lost to terror. This has been going on like this for more than 25 years with no signs of improvement.

 

 

  I am sorry for your family.A foreign person visiting this site for the love of Turkey or for any other reason cannot be expected or forced to share the grief of the loss of Turkish soldiers.However,A foreign person visiting this site for the love of Turkey or  for any other reason cannot be expected to support any terrorist group.That kind of people who supports any terrorist grup shouldnt join here.

(...)

 

DOes any body who is not Turkish need to be TUrk to love Turkey?should foreign people say: I can not say they are not terrorist even they killed babies, and 30000 turkish and kurdish people?People who doesnt say they are terrorist, should leave Turkishclass webpage, shouldnt learn turkish, shouldnt visit Turkey..We dont need enemy, we need friends.Welcome friends.

 

 

  I am sorry for your family.A foreign person visiting this site for the love of Turkey or for any other reason cannot be expected or forced to share the grief of the loss of Turkish soldiers.However,A foreign person visiting this site for the love of Turkey or  for any other reason cannot be expected to support any terrorist group.That kind of people who supports any terrorist grup shouldnt join here.

 

 

 

I agree with your point highlighted but you cannot stop people joining here with a hidden agenda...... I just wonder if you had anyone in mind, when you are referring to TC member (s) supporting PKK?  And what about a Turkish member supporting PKK? 

 

 

 

 

The only hidden agenda here is that of a member with a ´sleeper´ nickname who has become bored with ´nice´ TC and felt in the mood for stirring things up a bit.

 

IMHO 

 

 

 

Firstly, I consider PKK a terrorist organisation.

 

Secondly, why do you think that people visiting Turkey, being members here or learning Turkish must love Turkey? Look how many people hating evil west (The US in particular) speak English

 

In a free world people learn the languages they want to learn for many different reasons, not necessarily love. I don´t understand your point...

Maybe, we should all forget about this old reciprocity/retaliation mode of thinking. This is what splits people into camps. Don´t trust everything you read in newspapers. Sometimes whole nations are victimized for the want of circulation and publicity. I worked as a journalist for a couple of years, I know how news are cooked to get the desiredd effect on people. For long years, both in Turkey and in Europe, the man-in-the-street has been provided with a not-so-true picture of what is going on in these regions.

This has fueled the hatred between nations.

 

I would love a country for the loveable elements in it and not just because they love me back and vice versa.

 

 

 

 

 

The only hidden agenda here is that of an old member with a new nickname who has become bored with watching ´nice´ TC and felt in the mood for stirring things up a bit.

 

IMHO 

 

 

  Who is that old member with a new nickname? DO you know? can you answer?

 The person who caused to start this thread  is still member of this site.

 Everbady can learn turkish for any reason, however, no one can support a group which kills people.even she/he turk or from other countries.

 This site is for learning turkish and turkish culture.Not for  telling to people ´´I appreciate terrorist,enemy of Turkey´´

 

 

 

 You´re getting boring with your repetetive postings, Janissary/Lapinkulta/Oscarray.

 

 

 maybe you shouldnt join to this from to be not bored and not to being boring.Janissary/lapinkulta/Turdy

 

 

 That last typo revealed your identity. Well, FYI, as long as the owners tell me they like my contributions with pictures and essays I don´t mind YOU find me boring.

Cool down folks. Keep on discussing, this is the purpose of writing here. Nevertheless, you should make sure you are contributing with ideas worth discussing.

 

Oscarray, we read and understood your initial message. Now is the time for providing material supporting your point of view.

 

You left your earlier argument hanging in the balance. So, many people took offense at it. We don´t want to offend anyone don´t we? All we are seeking is understanding...

 

Also no matter how boring you may find somebody´s post, it is not polite to call it boring. There are so many messages that don´t appeal to me. I usually skip them. Imagine what would happen to our messages if a professional editor went through them. We are a bunch of amateurs striving to exchange opinions and to learn somethings in the process.

 

 

 why you try to reval your identity by using others..I dont find you boring, just rude.nothing else.. you should spend your time to lear turkish, you are not inspector, dont use informations you can not proof

 

  What kind of reasons we may have to learn turkish? is terrorism one of them?could be!!!

 

 

 

 Well yes I got bored today terrorising my fellow english speakers so I decided to learn turkish to reign terror on turks

 

 

 You didn´t terrorise me - yet.....

 

 

didn´t she? well, personally I feel a wee bit terrorised by Lessluv. I´ll ask my shrink about it

 

 

 You didn´t terrorise me - yet.....

 

 

 I was going to start on turks first ...then the dutch....and finishing with poles

 

 

 I was going to start on turks first ...then the dutch....and finishing with poles

Ok, I´ll wait for my turn (but please don´t wake me up, just tell me if you enjoyed it...   )

 

 

Everybody...HIDE!!! Lessluv is on the terrorising spree!!!

(Or shouldn´t I be commenting on her evil attempts because it´s impolite? Fortunately I suck at drawing or I might find a knife in my back)

 oi you two........unfair tag team pair up!!!

 In love and war they say everything is permitted....

 

Them Dutch You can always count on them! Trudy, tomorrow, 5.30am the drill starts! (I´ll bring vodka and you bring something to drink it down with)

 

 

 5.30AM? Ok, I´ll phone you to make sure you won´t sleep in....

 

 

ahm...did I say 5.30am? I meant pm of course

 

 

Sorry, that´ll be a raincheck. I´m most likely not home tomorrow at that time. I´m planning to take my mother to some nice restaurant now that I´m rich.....

 

 

rich you say? 5.30am is just fine

 

 

 ha ha that´s one way to get your laptop!!

 

 

 She wasn´t there! A missed chance...

 

 

 She wasn´t there! A missed chance...

 

 

Trudy! Of course I was there, you forgot about the time difference. I was there an hour AFTER you in full camouflage and army boots