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Harassment of the muslim woman in Turkey
(195 Messages in 20 pages - View all)
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50.       teaschip
3870 posts
 05 Jun 2007 Tue 11:27 pm

Freedom of religion in the US, someone mentioned here. I don't think so, especially in schools. They have abolished prayer in school and now the ten commandments. Know wonder we have so many kids who are unethical and have no morals. But it's not prohibited to wear a scarf or a cross of symbolic meaning to school. Before long I'm sure this to will be taken away. It's the minority who suffers! The majority says we should abolish smoking in restaurants even though we have smoking sections. Guess what nearly half the states in the US, you cannot smoke in a restaurant. I have decided over the last few months to change parties, I am now officially a libertarian. One last thing to mention concerning the post, you are permitted to wear head scarves in school & in public in the U.S. however, people do often judge it's book by it's cover. American woman have never really accepted the head scarf here in the U.S. and can't understand in todays world, in a country full of freedom (partially true) why a woman would want to hide herself. I am still puzzled with this as well, I have to admit. Woman are beautiful and shouldn't feel the need to hide their beauty no matter what religion they are. But on the other hand, I would never disrespect that person either. I understand customs and traditions and have a tolerance for such, but most people don't unfortunately.

51.       MrX67
2540 posts
 05 Jun 2007 Tue 11:31 pm

theres never place for any monoploy in true democracies pluralism always better in the rules..

52.       TeresaJana
304 posts
 06 Jun 2007 Wed 12:11 am

sometimes, one has to take a few steps backwards to see the wider road ahead and always there are obstacles to overcome and new roads branching out. eh, that's life.
If each individual said or claims to make everyone and everything around them peaceful and comfortable, I would call him a liar. all throughout history's past this is the case. If a higher power intended for men/women/woman/man to be equal in all ways as well as have the same way of thinking about things...
one might assume that higher power would become quite bored with humans. One person's alleged mistake is another person's opportunity or inspiration or discovery. Isnt that a wonderful thing?

Sampanya liked this message
53.       aslı
342 posts
 06 Jun 2007 Wed 12:12 am

I really have to ask this question. Şeriat does not allow to go 90 km. without a relative man with you. Şeriat does not allows being around and talk nicely with the man who u can marry. Also şeriat does not allow work outside home, if your husband dont want to (in that case most of them dont). Why are you willing so badly go to university if you cannot have a job anyway? If you insist to work, you will be sinner because you have to use vehicle, touch other men, talk other men, have to travel etc. If this is about education, u can attend college at home as u wish. But if u want to go governer college, you have to obey governer's rules.Simple. I think this is not about right of education. This is about being against the system and check how far they can push.

54.       aslı
342 posts
 06 Jun 2007 Wed 12:26 am

Atatürk ve Türban


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

"...Kimi yerlerde kadınlar görüyorum ki, başına bir bez, ya da bir peştemal ya da benzer bir şeyler atarak yüzünü, gözünü gizler ve yanından geçen erkeklere karşı ya arkasını çevirir, ya da yere oturarak yumulur. Bu durumun anlamı, gösterdiği nedir?
Efendiler uygar bir ulus anası, ulus kızı bu şaşırtıcı biçime, bu vahşi duruma girer mi? Bu durum ulusu çok gülünç gösteren bir görünüştür. Hemen düzeltilmesi gerekir."
Atatürk'ün Söylev ve Demeçleri,

I hope that would be an answer for Panta rei
Türk İnkılap Tarihi Enstitüsü Yay., C. II., s. 217.

55.       qdemir
813 posts
 06 Jun 2007 Wed 12:45 am

Quoting aslı:

I really have to ask this question. Şeriat does not allow to go 90 km. without a relative man with you. Şeriat does not allows being around and talk nicely with the man who u can marry. Also şeriat does not allow work outside home, if your husband dont want to (in that case most of them dont). Why are you willing so badly go to university if you cannot have a job anyway? If you insist to work, you will be sinner because you have to use vehicle, touch other men, talk other men, have to travel etc. If this is about education, u can attend college at home as u wish. But if u want to go governer college, you have to obey governer's rules.Simple. I think this is not about right of education. This is about being against the system and check how far they can push.



Are you stating that any woman wearing a headscarf is longing for Şeriat?, and is it only possible for girl students wearing a headscarf to take a university education in such a system? Also is having a university degree necessary for those who would like to work, or does any person with a university degree have to work? Education lasts a lifetime. It doesn't end when you finish university and have a job.

What would be your response to the below question?


Quoting panta rei:


Put all secularism, democracy, the republic laws, other muslims countries and the situations and women rights in those countries aside. I, too, need and will need secularism, democracy, the republic laws, and many more as much as everyone else needs. I have no problems with all these; they are always welcome. On the other hand, I do want to wear "turban", this is a human right, my right, my freedom. Just like everyone has the right and freedom not to wear turban wherever they like, I have the same to wear it wherever I like. So, how come my right and freedom to wear turban, can be forbidden?

56.       mltm
3690 posts
 06 Jun 2007 Wed 12:53 am

Just to say, it catched my eye two times here as reading. Iran is not an arabic country.

57.       panta rei
0 posts
 06 Jun 2007 Wed 12:54 am

Quoting aslı:

Atatürk ve Türban


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

"...Kimi yerlerde kadınlar görüyorum ki, BAŞINA bir bez, ya da bir peştemal ya da benzer bir şeyler atarak yüzünü, gözünü gizler ve yanından geçen erkeklere karşı ya arkasını çevirir, ya da yere oturarak yumulur. Bu durumun anlamı, gösterdiği nedir?



Thank you for enlightening me, aslı! I appreciated your answer very much. Now do you mind our looking at what Atatürk said more closer? I think you don't.

"Kimi yerlerde kadınlar görüyorum ki, başına bir bez, ya da bir peştemal ya da benzer bir şeyler atarak"

So true! This really describes me, my situation with turban. Let's continue...

"yüzünü"

Let's wait here! I didn't and don't mention covering my "face". I don't have such an intention or purpose either. So, this doesn't describe me and my situation. Because I do want to cover JUST and SIMPLY my HAIR, nothing more. Let's continue...

"gözünü"

Again, I don't want to and will not cover my "eyes", either. I will simply cover/hide my hair, that's all. Let's continue...

"yanından geçen erkeklere karşı ya arkasını çevirir, ya da yere oturarak yumulur"

I do assure you that I will even shake men's hands, let alone "turning my back to them or sitting on to the ground". Just permit me to wear my turban; and if I give such an impression, if I cover my face and/or eyes, then forbid me from wearing turban, and I will shut up. Even arrest me and send me a jail and keep me there till the end of my life. I SIMPLY and HONESTLY want to cover JUST my HAIR. Nothing more, believe me!

"Bu durumun anlamı, gösterdiği nedir?"

Now that "this situation"(the situations above) isn't related to me, my wish or my situation, and doesn't describe me, my intention and my purpose either, what "this situation" may mean, doesn't interests me at all.

So, tell me- why am I still forbidden from wearing turban?

58.       Deli_kizin
6376 posts
 06 Jun 2007 Wed 12:54 am

Quoting mltm:

Just to say, it catched my eye two times here as reading. Iran is not an arabic country.



Yes when writing mine İ realized that too, but I dont think there is much difference in their mentality, is there?

59.       aslı
342 posts
 06 Jun 2007 Wed 12:56 am

read my message again. they can attend a home college. rules also says you cannot wear exra mini skirts. any comments about that? U have to wear what the laws allows. If you try to brake the rules you will get punished somehow.
And Panta rei Atatürk died 69 years ago remember? If he did not he could say something pretty close what we say today to you. You(not in person) are not fighting simply for scarf. It is about doing something law and authorities says"dont". My mother wears a traditional scarf, she goes and went everywhere she wants. Turban is pretty differnt thing, you know it, ı know it, almost everyone know it.

60.       tutor
7 posts
 06 Jun 2007 Wed 12:58 am

Quoting qdemir:

Quoting aslı:

I really have to ask this question. Şeriat does not allow to go 90 km. without a relative man with you. Şeriat does not allows being around and talk nicely with the man who u can marry. Also şeriat does not allow work outside home, if your husband dont want to (in that case most of them dont). Why are you willing so badly go to university if you cannot have a job anyway? If you insist to work, you will be sinner because you have to use vehicle, touch other men, talk other men, have to travel etc. If this is about education, u can attend college at home as u wish. But if u want to go governer college, you have to obey governer's rules.Simple. I think this is not about right of education. This is about being against the system and check how far they can push.



Are you stating that any woman wearing a headscarf is longing for Şeriat?, and is it only possible for girl students wearing a headscarf to take a university education in such a system? Also is having a university degree necessary for those who would like to work, or does any person with a university degree have to work? Education lasts a lifetime. It doesn't end when you finish university and have a job.

What would be your response to the below question?


Quoting panta rei:


Put all secularism, democracy, the republic laws, other muslims countries and the situations and women rights in those countries aside. I, too, need and will need secularism, democracy, the republic laws, and many more as much as everyone else needs. I have no problems with all these; they are always welcome. On the other hand, I do want to wear "turban", this is a human right, my right, my freedom. Just like everyone has the right and freedom not to wear turban wherever they like, I have the same to wear it wherever I like. So, how come my right and freedom to wear turban, can be forbidden?



i agree with asli on her texts also she has already given the answer for your question qdemir!!!

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