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Forum Messages Posted by Abla

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Thread: my first topis (question)

81.       Abla
3648 posts
 13 Apr 2014 Sun 10:29 pm

Quote: Lina88

Osmanlı Devleti´nin ilk zamanlarında (kullanılan) gümüş akçe vardı.

 

"There was a silver coin which had been used in the early days of the Ottoman Empire."

 

kullan|ıl|an = VERB STEM + PASSIVE + PARTICIPLE

 

O akçe Osmanlı Devleti´nin ilk zamanlarında kullanıldı. ´it was used´

 

akçe is the grammatical subject of this passive sentence > the participle modifying it must be of the -(Y)EN type.



Edited (4/13/2014) by Abla

Khal and Lina88 liked this message


Thread: Neden/Niye

82.       Abla
3648 posts
 12 Apr 2014 Sat 08:01 pm

Quote: si++

I have a feeling that this sense of humour sounds familiar to me. Are you an old member with a new nickname?

I think so too but let´s see.



Thread: commas and full stops

83.       Abla
3648 posts
 12 Apr 2014 Sat 07:24 pm

The most informative place for a comma in Turkish is after the grammatical subject. For two reasons I guess:

 

- the subject phrase may consist of several words, modifiers + head

- what follows the subject in transitive sentences is most probably the object which  -  if indefinite  -  has no marking either.



Thread: -iyordu (past continuous) vs. -irdi (used to)

84.       Abla
3648 posts
 12 Apr 2014 Sat 07:16 pm

Quote: olphon

After you go beyond a certain level in a language, you´re lucky to find a one-to-one correspondence of anything. Everything that could be said is a huge surface and different languages cover it with different blankets of different sizes, differently. Furthermore, a correct translation of a correct translation does not always have to come back to itself.

Exactly. And we can go even further: not every language feels the urge to convey the same amount of information about the state of affairs described. There are gaps between the blankets. A simple example is grammatical gender.



Thread: -iyordu (past continuous) vs. -irdi (used to)

85.       Abla
3648 posts
 12 Apr 2014 Sat 04:01 pm

As a learner I cannot really answer your questions, Lillita, we need a native view for that. I will just share some of my thoughts and some things I have learned from literature (mostly Göksel - Kerslake 2010 ).

 

I think the correct native-like use of tenses is one of the most difficult things in Turkish. That is because tenses in any language are not only tenses but are also connected to the aspectual and modal views the speaker wants to express.

 

It is difficult to talk about Turkish tenses without referring to the notion of aspect at the same time. Compare the following sentences to understand the terminology:

 

She was singing (1) when I entered (2).

The neighbour´s dog used to wake my up every morning by barking. (3)

John is singing. (4)

 

(1) IMPERFECTIVE, not completed action

(2) PERFECTIVE, completed action

(3) HABITUAL

(4) PROGRESSIVE, action in progress

 

The Turkish equivalents are roughly as follows:

 

(1) -(I)YOR, -MAKTA, -(I)R, -(Y)DI (when attached to nominals)

(2) -DI, -MIŞ

(3) -(I)YOR, -MAKTA, -(I)R (in the past), olur/oluyor (in nominal sentences)

(4) -(I)YOR, -MAKTA

 

For habitual action, both -(I)YOR and -(I)R do the job at least in the past tense. The distribution between them is difficult for a learner to grasp.

 

The only meaning that -(I)R cannot convey is the progressive aspect. In my opinion, all your examples 1-5 represent progressive aspect and -(I)R cannot be used in them.

 

As a rule of thumb -(I)YOR partly laps together with the English BE + -ING construction (progressive action) but also has a wider use (habitual action).

 

If I was a native English speaker which I am not I would compare the use of would and -(IR)DI. Interesting similarities could come into light. Both can be used both for habitual action in the past and unreal (conditional) action.



Edited (4/12/2014) by Abla

Lillita liked this message


Thread: mi/midir

86.       Abla
3648 posts
 06 Apr 2014 Sun 10:46 pm

Quote: si++

Acaba gelmiş midir?

 

I see.

 

"Overloaded suffix" is a good description for DIR I guess. DIR kind of opens the door for various modal meanings concerning the truth value of the proposition and the speaker´s attitudes towards it. Göksel and Kerslake call it the marker of general modality if my memory does not fail me.



Thread: One more literature translation ;)

87.       Abla
3648 posts
 06 Apr 2014 Sun 10:40 pm

Quote: livingalive

1. "Yaşadığı hayattan kurtulmak için nerdeyse babası yaşındaki Adnan Bey´le evlenen Bihter´in mutsuz evliliği, Adnan Bey´in yeğeni Behlül´le yasak aşkı, bunun duyulması korkusuyla intiharını anlatır roman."

The novel tells of

1) the unhappy marriage of Bihter who in order to escape from the life she was living married Adnan Bey, who was almost the age of her father,

2) her forbidden love with Adnan Bey´s nephew Behlül

3) her committing suicide because of the fear of this love being revealed.



Thread: mi/midir

88.       Abla
3648 posts
 06 Apr 2014 Sun 07:07 pm

Quote: si++

First of all it´s an overloaded suffix. Sometimes you can use it for probability (for example when you are speaking about something that you are not sure of) and sometimes for info passing (if you have a feeling that you are giving -or passing- some information to the addressee that you think he/she is not aware of), etc.

 

How can you express probability or pass information in a question?



Thread: mi/midir

89.       Abla
3648 posts
 05 Apr 2014 Sat 03:06 pm

I never used midir in my life. :O



Thread: T-E Nazim Hikmet Ölüme Dair Şiiri

90.       Abla
3648 posts
 03 Apr 2014 Thu 06:49 pm

Quote: Lololooo

"Buyrun, oturun dostlar, 

hoş gelip sefalar getirdiniz. 
Biliyorum, ben uyurken 
hücreme pencereden girdiniz. 
Ne ince boyunlu ilâç şişesini 
ne kırmızı kutuyu devirdiniz. 
Yüzünüzde yıldızların aydınlığı 
başucumda durup el ele verdiniz. 
Buyrun, oturun dostlar 

hoş gelip sefalar getirdiniz." 

My Try:

 

Please come in, sit down friends,

welcome, bring pleasure with you.

I know, while I was sleeping

you entered my prison cell through the window.

You neither dropped the narrow necked vial

nor the red box. (I guess he means the items on the windowsill...)

Moonlight on your faces,

you stopped at my bedside, joined hands.

Please come in, sit down friends,

welcome, bring pleasure with you.

Lololooo liked this message


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