I didn´t say this in order to hurt you. I said if you will be happy this way. Maybe I am not doing the right thing to dont deserve you either but certainly I will not leave give up on you. I will not leave give up on you, don´t forget this.

Thank you so much, gokuyum. Expressing past certainty seems to be today´s lesson for me. A couple of more remarks if you don´t mind:

1. Hep “Ağzı Ağız açık ken yemek yenmemeli”: In the English translation there was talk about ´one´s mouth´, ´one´s elbows´. It´s good to know impersonal passive in Turkish works in this kind of instructions which are given to people in general, but it seems that in this case you cannot use 3rd person possessive suffix to refer to this general person, isn´t it?

2. Herhangi birimiz olabilir: Queueing pronouns like this was something new to me but while making the translation I already doubted that the whole meaning was not in birimiz. Interesting.

3. Isn´t there any way in Turkish to express ´by six o´clock´, ´any time before six o´clock but not later´? I thought about saat altıya kadar but it didn´t sound right.

I guess I can´t get further with these on my own:

1. Frank´s wallet is lying on the coffee table. He must have left it here last night. Frank’in cüzdanı kahve masasında yatıyor. Dün gece onu burada bırakmış olmalı ydı.

2. Mrs. Scarlett´s body was found in the lounge just moments ago, and it´s still warm! Nobody has left the mansion this evening, so the killer must be someone in this room. It may be any one of us. Bayan Scarlett’in cesedi sadece birkaç an dakika önce bulundu, daha ılıktır hala sıcak. Hiç kimse bu gece konaktan ayrılmadı, o yüzden katil bu odadaki biri olmalı. Herhangi birimiz olabilir.

3. Ted´s flight from Amsterdam took more than 11 hours. He must be exhausted after such a long flight. He should prefer to stay in tonight and get some rest. Ted’in Amsterdam’dan uçuşu 11 saatten daha fazla sürdü. O kadar uzun uçuştan sonra çok yorgun olmalı. Bu gece içinde kalıp biraz dinlense ona iyi olur.

4. My uncle’s car broke down last weekend and he had to have it towed more than fifty kilometres. It must have cost a fortune. Amcamin arabası geçen haftasonu kırmış bozulmuş ve onu 50 kilometreden daha fazla onu çektirmek zorunda kalmış. Bir servete mal olmuş olmalı ydı.

5. When I was a child my grandmother was continually correcting our manners. She always used to say, "One must not eat with one’s mouth open.” Or she would correct us by saying “One shouldn’t rest one’s elbows on the table. And every time I wanted to leave the table, she would say: “One must ask to be excused.” Ben çocukken büyükannem sürekli bir şekilde tavırlarımızı düzeltiyordu. Hep “Ağzı Ağız açık ken yemek yenmemeli” derdi. Ya da “Dirsekleri  Dirseklerle masadan destek alınmamalı” diye bizi doğrulttu düzeltirdi. Ve her zaman ben masadan ayrılmak isterken “İzin verilmeli istenmeli” derdi.

6. I´ve redone this math problem at least twenty times, but my answer is wrong according to the answer key. The answer in the book must be wrong. Bu matematik sorununu en az yırmı kez yeniden çözdüm, ama cevabım cetvele  cevap anahtarına göre yanlış(tır). Kitaptaki cevap yanlış olmalı(dır).

7. The television isn´t working. It must have damaged during the move. Televizyon çalışmıyor. Taşınma boyunca sırasında zarar vermiş görmüş olmalı ydi.

8. You must be kidding! That can´t be true. Elbette Dalga geçiyorsun geçiyor olmalısın. Bu gerçek olamıyor olamaz.

9. Firefighters must be able to climb high ladders, swim 400 metres in less than 12 minutes and carry heavy equipment. İtfaiyeciler, yüksek merdivenlere tırmanıp 400 metreyi 12’den daha az dakikada yüzüp ağır bir donatım taşıyabilmeliler.

10. Do you always have to say the first thing that pops into your head. Couldn’t you think once in a while before you speak? Başına Aklına gelen birinci ilk şeyi hep söylemeli misin? Konuşmadan önce arada bir düşünebilir düşünemez misin?

11. Terry and Frank said they would come over right after work. They should be here by 6:00. Terry ile Frank hemen işten sonra geleceklerini söylediler. Burada Saat altıda burada olmalılar.

12. Israel may be forced to attack Iran’s nuclear facilities. İsrail İran nükleer tesislerine saldırmak mecburiyetinde kalabilir.

selam arkadaşlar

can I say

herşey yolundadır = everything is ok

teşekkür ederim

selam arkadaşlar

can I say

herşey yolundadır = everything is ok

teşekkür ederim

Tesekkur ederim harpoon.The only meaning that escapes me is damatlığını. What is the meaning?

The pleasure is all mine.

Reflexive + passive certainly has its function in language as your examples show, scalpel. But still it doesn´t erase the fact that there is always a chance for analogy also. We can say it is even probable that these forms spread wider than they were actually ment for by means of analogy, just like gokuyum said earlier. Because for an average language user it is a choice between models: real models and invented models, understood and misunderstood models...

Wow, this turned out a nice thread eventually (even though at some point I thought I messed it).

It´s just that some natives do not find it enough or even do not recognise the passive meaning and add another passive suffix.

Grammatically correct way:

de-n-mek is the passive of de-mek

söyle-n-mek is the passive of söyle-mek

etc.

Eve geldiğine kadar bekleyemeyeceğim.

My Try.

Deli´s score is not high when compared to tunci´s! She posted 5345 posts in a period of seven years and tunci 2444 in a period of eleven months or so..this means tunci will make it (inşallah) 17200 in 2017 and it will be at least 3 times more than deli´s, and we will be right if we think tunci spends at least half of his life infront of the screen of his tired laptop 

a note for deli: You are the gem of this forum and I love you